Music tracks that I composed

Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby capricom45 » 08 Jun 2015, 13:34

0zone0ne {l Wrote}:@ capricom45
I tried emailing you, please tell me if it arrives and don't forget to check in spam. :)

Hey, i just got it, it's in the spam folder but for a different reason
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby capricom45 » 11 Jun 2015, 22:40

Due to an unforeseen circumstance, I'm returning to try and compose music for SuperTuxKart starting from Friday, June 12th 2015, 14:00 IDT (UTC+3)
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby ArDanWol » 20 Jun 2015, 18:06

I've been thinking your "complete_surprise.ogg" music track would go well with a track similar to "Tux Tollway" (on a highway or interstate). Does anyone agree with me?
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby capricom45 » 22 Jun 2015, 23:03

ArDanWol {l Wrote}:I've been thinking your "complete_surprise.ogg" music track would go well with a track similar to "Tux Tollway" (on a highway or interstate). Does anyone agree with me?

I didn't think about that, I just went head-on. (Which wasn't a very good idea)
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby capricom45 » 05 Jul 2015, 15:16

Bump.
I'm working on a few music tracks, and am not sure if they'll fit the current musical style of SuperTuxKart.

Post them here anyway?
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby GeekPenguinBR » 05 Jul 2015, 23:19

Hi, capricom45.

I have posted a message like this including a song composed by myself two months ago, but I removed it some minutes later for some reason. Now, I'm posting the message again. Let me take part in this nice debate. I have no much free time because I'm working on (personal projects, of course and) a really big contribution for STK.

I'm from Brazil and I have played STK since 2009. Two years ago, my younger brother Tuxkartdriver started to consider some colaboration to this game. I was not an artist in 3D, but he gave me some lessons on Maya and I started modelling. At first, I started modelling urban plants. So, I made a nice port. but that was not the style of STK. My brother always saying "you are doing urban plants instead scenary for games. Well, I spent some months until I could realize my own style to fit the style of this game. My project "Las Dunas Arena" is better than the first one, "Port", paused at the moment. I have other tracks, but now, I have in mind the style of the game. Maybe, sometimes I will "break the rules" to invent something different.

I have a formal education in business and marketing, but I'm an artist and a musician too. I started learning music when I was 10 years old. I am over 30, so, more than 20 years ago. Ok. I'm an instrumentalist (guitar, saxophone and some other) and a composer too. I have songs in diverse musical styles including classical and baroque, but most are smooth jazz and instrumental rock. Well, I have a very rigid quality control. So, I don't consider a song composed by myself as a good song if I could not consider it good listening it on the radio or web. If I consider my song enough good, it's good, no matter the opinion of other musicians. It's not arrogance (I'm aware this may seems a bit arrogant, but I hate arrogance), but a bit of knowledge and self confidence. My song will not change it quality turning itself good or bad because someone liked or disliked it. It's a matter of personal taste. I know if the song is good or not, but, fits the song the STK style? What's the musical style of STK?

I have heard some songs composed by you. Most, electronic music, but it's true that the electronic music doesn't fit much the style fo STK if you consider the current tracks. They had a track called "Night Club" and another one called "The Cube". This one, had electronic music as sound track. Since they removed those tracks, no other track fits the electronic style. Your songs may be good enough for parties at KazanTip, but STK demands a bit more "childish" and innocent music style. The hard part is to combine specific themes and the musical style of STK. In Brazil people say "you must dance according to the song". As a graphic artist, I know that it's very dumb to show a folder with a lot of serious drawings like Barbarian warriors or vampires, Draculas and monsters of Frankenstein if I'm applying to a job in Rovio to draw Angry birds.

Here (talking about STK), If the team of developers have stablished a certain visual and musical style, we must to fit our songs to the game's style, no matter if it's good or not. This is their personal taste. Their opinions don't make my hipotetical song sounds better or worst. It's just a matter of personal taste and they have the right to include or not my song if they are the project leaders. They have their marketing for their public: the fans of STK. We, the colaborers, have our own marketing for our publics: the fans and the developers as if we were working on an advertsing for some specific public, but, like an advertising agency we need to convince the company (the STK team) that hired our agency to elaborate the campaign. In other words, we need to have in mind the visual or musical message to communicate for the gamers, but we need, also, to make the team approve it prior. It's easy to convince someone when we give him/her what he/she wants. This is marketing. We study the target, their habits, behavior and their minds. So, we offer them the product they need and they wish. The team of STK developers have their musical preferences, so, that's the product you may give them if you want to be accepted.

Auria (the person who defines the musical style) may like some songs that you and me don't like and she may dislike songs that we like, but if she is one of the leaders, she has the right to chose the song according her perferences and personal taste. We need to try to compose a song that fits the musical style of STK. Auria liked the Krobonil's and Ozone's styles. This doesn't mean that their songs are right and other rejected/removed songs are wrong. It's just a matter of personal preference of the developers. So, if the song sounds like those ones included in the game, it has a good chance to be accept. If the song sounds too much rock like a "garage band" demo, a "serious" symphony, a military march or anything else, it has a good chance to be rejected.

IMO, we may (and we must) try to compose in any musical style to fit the "atmosphere" of the track. Having the track on our minds, we just need to think about what musical style, melody and rythm could express the message compatible with the environment of the track. For instance: I have a track (a real one) placed somewhere in Europe (I know exactly where, but this is a secret for while) in another era. The track starts in a sunny day of autumn, so, the karts going though a forest of pines until they arrive at the portal of somewhere (a special building). The track is placed in a local that remind us adventure, warriors, fights and fantastic stories, but the environment around is beautiful and calm. I needed a song that could express the beauty of that place, the peaceful morning of autunm, the smell of the red and orange dead leaves on the earth and everything else. So, this song came to my mind (it's almost completed, but still a work in progress and a secret, so I can't show more):
Work in Progress Song.ogg
(614.22 KiB) Downloaded 53 times


It's not correctly mixed yet, but the melody is that. Is this the perfect song for the musical style of STK according the team's opinions? I don't know, but I'm sure that this is the perfect song for my creation (the track), because it expresses exactly what I want to make the gamers fell while driving and I'm doing it in the right direction. I can't imagine a track located in the former Soviet Union (I have one called "Cosmodrome") with country music as musical backgroung as well I can't imagine a track in Texas with Polca or a track in some Asian metropolis with a typical French song. It's not a matter of personal taste. It's a matter of common sense. The game itself "has not the right to force" the gamers to hear a sound that doesn't fits the track, but, what if I compose "an authentic" song according the musical style of the USA for my track "Las Dunas Arena" and they (the team) dislike? I don't know. It's their problem, not mine, but I wouldn't like to see the Schnuffel theme song replacing my rock song or country music no matter how cute the chosen song may be just because they prefer the Schnuffel song (I like it, by the way). It's a matter of logic as it works in Marketing: the right message for the right public in the right campaign.

So, I advice you (and this is just an advice) to listen hard the STK soundtrack as well the soundtrack of other games like "Sonic all stars", "F1 stars" and other. Maybe a lot of those songs made for other games would be rejected by the STK developers and it's obvious that's those songs are not bad, since they were composed by professional composers who works for big companies, but, it's all about personal taste!

The composers who have already songs included in this game are the guys who offered the product for a certain public (in this case Auria and the developers) and the public liked the product. They made their marketing in the right way. Think like a concurrent and try to offer your own product based on the taste of your primary target (Auria dn the developers). This is your personal marketing to take part as an official contributor. Just avoid wasting your time in a direction they don't want to go on.

I don't believe that a composer has a big chance making the contrary "here my songs, chose some of them for your tracks". Prefer to work on some project based on a specific track. Not always we hit the bullseye, but at least, we tried it in the right way.

Sorry for this book.
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby capricom45 » 06 Jul 2015, 06:02

GeekPenguinBR {l Wrote}:Hi, capricom45.

I have posted a message like this including a song composed by myself two months ago, but I removed it some minutes later for some reason. Now, I'm posting the message again. Let me take part in this nice debate. I have no much free time because I'm working on (personal projects, of course and) a really big contribution for STK.

I'm from Brazil and I have played STK since 2009. Two years ago, my younger brother Tuxkartdriver started to consider some colaboration to this game. I was not an artist in 3D, but he gave me some lessons on Maya and I started modelling. At first, I started modelling urban plants. So, I made a nice port. but that was not the style of STK. My brother always saying "you are doing urban plants instead scenary for games. Well, I spent some months until I could realize my own style to fit the style of this game. My project "Las Dunas Arena" is better than the first one, "Port", paused at the moment. I have other tracks, but now, I have in mind the style of the game. Maybe, sometimes I will "break the rules" to invent something different.

I have a formal education in business and marketing, but I'm an artist and a musician too. I started learning music when I was 10 years old. I am over 30, so, more than 20 years ago. Ok. I'm an instrumentalist (guitar, saxophone and some other) and a composer too. I have songs in diverse musical styles including classical and baroque, but most are smooth jazz and instrumental rock. Well, I have a very rigid quality control. So, I don't consider a song composed by myself as a good song if I could not consider it good listening it on the radio or web. If I consider my song enough good, it's good, no matter the opinion of other musicians. It's not arrogance (I'm aware this may seems a bit arrogant, but I hate arrogance), but a bit of knowledge and self confidence. My song will not change it quality turning itself good or bad because someone liked or disliked it. It's a matter of personal taste. I know if the song is good or not, but, fits the song the STK style? What's the musical style of STK?

I have heard some songs composed by you. Most, electronic music, but it's true that the electronic music doesn't fit much the style fo STK if you consider the current tracks. They had a track called "Night Club" and another one called "The Cube". This one, had electronic music as sound track. Since they removed those tracks, no other track fits the electronic style. Your songs may be good enough for parties at KazanTip, but STK demands a bit more "childish" and innocent music style. The hard part is to combine specific themes and the musical style of STK. In Brazil people say "you must dance according to the song". As a graphic artist, I know that it's very dumb to show a folder with a lot of serious drawings like Barbarian warriors or vampires, Draculas and monsters of Frankenstein if I'm applying to a job in Rovio to draw Angry birds.

Here (talking about STK), If the team of developers have stablished a certain visual and musical style, we must to fit our songs to the game's style, no matter if it's good or not. This is their personal taste. Their opinions don't make my hipotetical song sounds better or worst. It's just a matter of personal taste and they have the right to include or not my song if they are the project leaders. They have their marketing for their public: the fans of STK. We, the colaborers, have our own marketing for our publics: the fans and the developers as if we were working on an advertsing for some specific public, but, like an advertising agency we need to convince the company (the STK team) that hired our agency to elaborate the campaign. In other words, we need to have in mind the visual or musical message to communicate for the gamers, but we need, also, to make the team approve it prior. It's easy to convince someone when we give him/her what he/she wants. This is marketing. We study the target, their habits, behavior and their minds. So, we offer them the product they need and they wish. The team of STK developers have their musical preferences, so, that's the product you may give them if you want to be accepted.

Auria (the person who defines the musical style) may like some songs that you and me don't like and she may dislike songs that we like, but if she is one of the leaders, she has the right to chose the song according her perferences and personal taste. We need to try to compose a song that fits the musical style of STK. Auria liked the Krobonil's and Ozone's styles. This doesn't mean that their songs are right and other rejected/removed songs are wrong. It's just a matter of personal preference of the developers. So, if the song sounds like those ones included in the game, it has a good chance to be accept. If the song sounds too much rock like a "garage band" demo, a "serious" symphony, a military march or anything else, it has a good chance to be rejected.

IMO, we may (and we must) try to compose in any musical style to fit the "atmosphere" of the track. Having the track on our minds, we just need to think about what musical style, melody and rythm could express the message compatible with the environment of the track. For instance: I have a track (a real one) placed somewhere in Europe (I know exactly where, but this is a secret for while) in another era. The track starts in a sunny day of autumn, so, the karts going though a forest of pines until they arrive at the portal of somewhere (a special building). The track is placed in a local that remind us adventure, warriors, fights and fantastic stories, but the environment around is beautiful and calm. I needed a song that could express the beauty of that place, the peaceful morning of autunm, the smell of the red and orange dead leaves on the earth and everything else. So, this song came to my mind (it's almost completed, but still a work in progress and a secret, so I can't show more):
Work in Progress Song.ogg


It's not correctly mixed yet, but the melody is that. Is this the perfect song for the musical style of STK according the team's opinions? I don't know, but I'm sure that this is the perfect song for my creation (the track), because it expresses exactly what I want to make the gamers fell while driving and I'm doing it in the right direction. I can't imagine a track located in the former Soviet Union (I have one called "Cosmodrome") with country music as musical backgroung as well I can't imagine a track in Texas with Polca or a track in some Asian metropolis with a typical French song. It's not a matter of personal taste. It's a matter of common sense. The game itself "has not the right to force" the gamers to hear a sound that doesn't fits the track, but, what if I compose "an authentic" song according the musical style of the USA for my track "Las Dunas Arena" and they (the team) dislike? I don't know. It's their problem, not mine, but I wouldn't like to see the Schnuffel theme song replacing my rock song or country music no matter how cute the chosen song may be just because they prefer the Schnuffel song (I like it, by the way). It's a matter of logic as it works in Marketing: the right message for the right public in the right campaign.

So, I advice you (and this is just an advice) to listen hard the STK soundtrack as well the soundtrack of other games like "Sonic all stars", "F1 stars" and other. Maybe a lot of those songs made for other games would be rejected by the STK developers and it's obvious that's those songs are not bad, since they were composed by professional composers who works for big companies, but, it's all about personal taste!

The composers who have already songs included in this game are the guys who offered the product for a certain public (in this case Auria and the developers) and the public liked the product. They made their marketing in the right way. Think like a concurrent and try to offer your own product based on the taste of your primary target (Auria dn the developers). This is your personal marketing to take part as an official contributor. Just avoid wasting your time in a direction they don't want to go on.

I don't believe that a composer has a big chance making the contrary "here my songs, chose some of them for your tracks". Prefer to work on some project based on a specific track. Not always we hit the bullseye, but at least, we tried it in the right way.

Sorry for this book.


Wow, Too much information for me to read. I did read what OzoneOne emailed me, seeing as I'm trying to fit my current tracks (the older tracks are invalid, I have to mix them properly - I don't remember the way the melody behaves, or how it is written) to STK's overall feel. I did listen to the sound track, and some songs - particularly, "kart_grand_prix" sound a bit boring.

If you want to contact me to discuss this in private, my email resides here: /viewtopic.php?p=64482#p64482. Just don't send me an email the size of that post
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby Auria » 06 Jul 2015, 23:47

Very nice post, GeekPenguinBR. I agree with most of what you said, and I also agree that composition should be targeted at a specific track that we decide needs an improved song (rather than the other way around of trying to pick a song from a bunch you already have). It's also important of course to pick a track, discuss whether we believe the current song needs to be replaced (if we already like the current song, trying to replace it probably won't work!). Then a new song can be made specifically for that track, it's also a good idea to post work-in-progress samples to get early feedback before spending hours on it. Listening to our current soundtrack is also very important, we have indeed decided on a style for our soundtrack and in order to stay consistent songs should be somewhere within the current style.
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby capricom45 » 07 Jul 2015, 00:23

Auria {l Wrote}:Very nice post, GeekPenguinBR. I agree with most of what you said, and I also agree that composition should be targeted at a specific track that we decide needs an improved song (rather than the other way around of trying to pick a song from a bunch you already have). It's also important of course to pick a track, discuss whether we believe the current song needs to be replaced (if we already like the current song, trying to replace it probably won't work!). Then a new song can be made specifically for that track, it's also a good idea to post work-in-progress samples to get early feedback before spending hours on it. Listening to our current soundtrack is also very important, we have indeed decided on a style for our soundtrack and in order to stay consistent songs should be somewhere within the current style.

What track? the one with the electronica-style song? or others?

>It's also important of course to pick a track, discuss whether we believe the current song needs to be replaced (if we already like the current song, trying to replace it probably won't work!).
When did such a discussion happen?

>Then a new song can be made specifically for that track, it's also a good idea to post work-in-progress samples to get early feedback before spending hours on it.
Which I never hear about, and find out after the track and song land in svn. I never hear any sort of feedback on the tracks that I do post. which is why I never post any WIP audio samples.

Sometimes I feel like I'm not welcome here.
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby 0zone0ne » 07 Jul 2015, 00:39

GeekPenguinBR {l Wrote}:Sorry for this book.

It was a good book though. ;)

Let me also just point out that at first, it took me a long time and many tries to get music into the game. So don't feel discouraged!
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby capricom45 » 07 Jul 2015, 01:52

0zone0ne {l Wrote}:
GeekPenguinBR {l Wrote}:Sorry for this book.

It was a good book though. ;)

Let me also just point out that at first, it took me a long time and many tries to get music into the game. So don't feel discouraged!

FYI to 0zone0ne: I'm still waiting for a reply from you.

I'll consider if I should even think of trying to compose, because I raised a few points in a previous post.

As for samples? not sure I can provide any sample, because most of them are considered "noise"
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby GeekPenguinBR » 07 Jul 2015, 02:05

Auria {l Wrote}:Very nice post, GeekPenguinBR. I agree with most of what you said, and I also agree that composition should be targeted at a specific track that we decide needs an improved song (rather than the other way around of trying to pick a song from a bunch you already have)... Listening to our current soundtrack is also very important, we have indeed decided on a style for our soundtrack and in order to stay consistent songs should be somewhere within the current style.


Thank you, Auria. At first, I was inclined to pick one of my songs and show it here as a composition for a current, former or new track, but this doesn't works or rarely works, when the song fits easily the track.


0zone0ne {l Wrote}:
GeekPenguinBR {l Wrote}:Sorry for this book.

It was a good book though. ;)


Hahaha... I wrote a lot, this time:D
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby capricom45 » 09 Jul 2015, 00:54

Ugh, I had a freudian slip when naming a sample: http://1drv.ms/1LSU3gJ

I have no idea as to where can this sample/completed song (when it's done) will fit within STK's music style. or what track can be used with it

What do you think? does it fit?

Right now, that sample is a drums and bass track. I will update the track with new instruments very soon - a guitar and a synth that sing in the same phrase/same chords. perhaps I will shoehorn a saxophone too.
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby ArDanWol » 09 Jul 2015, 02:53

Would you mind posting your audio file on the forum or emailing it to me using the button under my user image? I seem to have trouble accessing the OneDrive website. I'd really love to hear it! :)
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby capricom45 » 09 Jul 2015, 02:55

ArDanWol {l Wrote}:Would you mind posting your audio file on the forum or emailing it to me using the button under my user image? I seem to have trouble accessing the OneDrive website. I'd really love to hear it! :)

Not sure about the maximum file size on the forum. Yeah, I'll try.
edit: Email sent
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby ArDanWol » 09 Jul 2015, 02:59

Thanks! :)
I'm know pretty much everywhere else on the internet as "Kpenguin"
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby capricom45 » 09 Jul 2015, 03:02

ArDanWol {l Wrote}:Thanks! :)

you're welcome, but the email system for the forum doesn't allow attachments as far as I know,

I'll send it as soon as I receive a reply.
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby capricom45 » 09 Jul 2015, 03:32

quick bump:
Keep your speakers/headphones under 50%

Edit: I updated the sample with a percussion and Synthesizer

Note about the synthesizer: it sings like a guitar

OneDrive: http://1drv.ms/1frnL0i

Google Drive: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5a0TY ... sp=sharing
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Re: Music tracks that I composed - Track update

Postby capricom45 » 10 Jul 2015, 00:26

Even though I received no feedback on the sample that I posted. (3K+ members on forum, and around 20 are active)
I updated the track.

OneDrive: http://1drv.ms/1J71iwB
Google Drive: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5a0TY ... sp=sharing

Does this fit into STK's music style?
Did I read your feedback? I actually did, by skimming it.

What's your general opinion on it?
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby ArDanWol » 10 Jul 2015, 03:01

Headed in the right direction. This sounds like it definitely belongs in an evening/nightly landscape type track. The background noise reminded me of crickets in the evening. It would probably go with a nightly version of green valley. Can't say I 100% like it all the way, but it's heading in the right direction for sure.

BTW, if you want people to listen to your updated track that you got no feedback on, please make it in a separate post rather than an edit. If you make it a separate post, it will show as an unread post unlike an edit. Personally, I usually only click on a thread when there is an unread post, so I didn't even see your edit until you posted the next track.
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby ArDanWol » 10 Jul 2015, 03:09

After listening to your previous track, I'm not sure that the main instrument (sounds like a cross between a violin and a trumpet or saxophone to me) fits the theme of the song. I like the notes, but the instrument sounds out of place. I don't know... just personal opinion. ;)
I'm know pretty much everywhere else on the internet as "Kpenguin"
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby capricom45 » 10 Jul 2015, 10:16

ArDanWol {l Wrote}:After listening to your previous track, I'm not sure that the main instrument (sounds like a cross between a violin and a trumpet or saxophone to me) fits the theme of the song. I like the notes, but the instrument sounds out of place. I don't know... just personal opinion. ;)

Hey, thanks for the feedback. there are 3 main instruments (3 loud ones): a synth, the drums, and an alto saxophone. (there's also bass, and a percussion track). which one were you referring to?

As for the separate post thing, I try to avoid that.
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Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby ArDanWol » 10 Jul 2015, 13:48

I think it's the saxophone.
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Location: Ohio, USA

Re: Music tracks that I composed

Postby capricom45 » 10 Jul 2015, 14:13

ArDanWol {l Wrote}:I think it's the saxophone.

Noted, I'll update the track in a few minutes
Socially banned since 2014, a somewhat sleepy musician
capricom45
 
Posts: 98
Joined: 10 Oct 2014, 14:05

Re: Music tracks that I composed - Track Update No 2

Postby capricom45 » 10 Jul 2015, 19:59

I updated the track a second time,

Google Drive: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5a0TY ... sp=sharing
OneDrive: http://1drv.ms/1HSsy7g

the filename is temporary, I will have to come up with a different filename
I lowered the saxophone's volume a bit and lowered the overall sound level.

Again: Keep your headphones/sound system under 50% volume
Socially banned since 2014, a somewhat sleepy musician
capricom45
 
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