My feedback

My feedback

Postby MCMic » 09 Feb 2013, 15:42

Hello,

Yesterday I tried this game for the first time after successfully packaging it for ArchLinux.
Here are my thoughts on it:
- I failed to make my gamepad work with it, I had to use the keyboard. (my gamepad works with supertuxkart for instance, so I'm not sure what the problem is)
- I found the game a bit ugly, portrait and landscape pictures are really pretty but the render of the sprites seems blurry. (I play in 1024xsomething). The light effect on window is nice but a bit out of place as the only «seeable» advanced effect. It also seems like there are problems with textures as they are not matching as they should at some places (meaning we can see the line between two sprites).
- The animations on characters are a good idea but the «water drop» effect seems often misused, it should only held one meaning, not be the thing that appear each time a character feels something. Same problem with the yellow exclamation mark, it's used as a quest indicator, as in some other games (regnum online does that for instance), but it is also used at some place that have nothing to do with quests. You should user an other color in this cases, a red one seems ok for showing the angryness (or surprise?) of a character.
Finally, I can't get past the green blobs in forest, all I'm able to do without dying is fighting the first ones and go back to the healing fountain. Characters reached level 2, I bought them clothes and they still seems too weak to go into the forest by themselve, it's kind of annoying me. (The game feels like a one-button one at this point.)

So, good job on releasing this game, I was happy to play it, sorry for all these bad comments but I guess it's better to point out things that does not work in a game. My main issue still is this «I feel terrible as it seems I'm not able to find a stupid child in a forest» problem, but I'm working on it :-D

PS: I had trouble finding my words in english there, fill free to ask me to rephrase any part you would have trouble to understand.
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Re: My feedback

Postby MCMic » 10 Feb 2013, 20:46

Found a bug : when fighting a blob mom, if I die and ask to restart the fight, the blobs createds during the fight are not removed.
Also, once after a fight near a tree I was stuck in the tree. I could turn but not move.
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Re: My feedback

Postby Bertram » 11 Feb 2013, 07:38

Hi MCMic,

Thanks for trying it, and again for the package!

MCMic {l Wrote}:- I failed to make my gamepad work with it, I had to use the keyboard. (my gamepad works with supertuxkart for instance, so I'm not sure what the problem is)

Thanks for pointing out, I'll check.

MCMic {l Wrote}:- I found the game a bit ugly, portrait and landscape pictures are really pretty but the render of the sprites seems blurry. (I play in 1024xsomething). The light effect on window is nice but a bit out of place as the only «seeable» advanced effect. It also seems like there are problems with textures as they are not matching as they should at some places (meaning we can see the line between two sprites).

Sorry to hear that, yet, have you tried to set Tiles to smoothed in the video options?
As for the tiles, I don't know whether it's coming from the fact that I was a rusty mapper at the time, or whether the tileset is lacking transitions tiles. I've yet said I would be done with the village for now and focus on what's next in the story. Who knows, if a good mapper manages to compile the editor and play with the tiles, you may see it improve. ;)

MCMic {l Wrote}:- The animations on characters are a good idea but the «water drop» effect seems often misused, it should only held one meaning, not be the thing that appear each time a character feels something. Same problem with the yellow exclamation mark, it's used as a quest indicator, as in some other games (regnum online does that for instance), but it is also used at some place that have nothing to do with quests. You should user an other color in this cases, a red one seems ok for showing the angryness (or surprise?) of a character

Character emotes aren't meant to mean only one thing, I do think it depends on the context just like it does in mangas, by the way. That said, a "new quest" better marker could be welcome as I realized we let the exclamation mark as a good but still placeholder. I'll have a look at that sooner or later. I'll also add the new "angry veins" emote now I've done it.

MCMic {l Wrote}:Finally, I can't get past the green blobs in forest, all I'm able to do without dying is fighting the first ones and go back to the healing fountain. Characters reached level 2, I bought them clothes and they still seems too weak to go into the forest by themselve, it's kind of annoying me. (The game feels like a one-button one at this point.)

Yeah, the game beginning is just like retro 80s-RPG games, where your party feels miserable at the beginning of the game, I still hope what's coming in the next part of the story will be more interesting, as you'll start to manage your skills based on your equipment, and other surprises I'll try to put along the road. I must say the central content point will remain the story though. ;)

MCMic {l Wrote}:So, good job on releasing this game, I was happy to play it, sorry for all these bad comments but I guess it's better to point out things that does not work in a game. My main issue still is this «I feel terrible as it seems I'm not able to find a stupid child in a forest» problem, but I'm working on it :-D

Thanks, and the other ones helping will also appreciate I hope. You being happy to play it is core motivation of it all. :) Good luck on finding Orlinn, well, before something else finds you, as you may have seen. ;)

Regards,
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Re: My feedback

Postby IkarusDowned » 13 Feb 2013, 16:46

Hi MCMic!
Thanks for the feedback! Its always good to hear constructive criticism as well as postive feedback. Along with some of the things that Bertram mentioned, I would just like to mention a couple things

- some of the images you see are still "stock." Namely, as you pointed out the quest-exclamation point and the "world map." At the moment those are feature placeholders as opposed to final resources.

- For some of the bugs, especially the visual ones you mentioned, it would be really great if you wouldn't mind posting screenshots and / or how to replicate the bug? As developers, we sometimes get tunnel-vision and it takes a screenshot or demo of the problem for us to come to terms with it. The best would be if you could open a "issue ticket" on GitHub and add the information there, but if that is a bit too much work, posting it here on the forums would also be greatly appreciated :)

Thanks again!
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Re: My feedback

Postby Bertram » 20 Feb 2013, 21:02

Hi,

Found a bug : when fighting a blob mom, if I die and ask to restart the fight, the blobs createds during the fight are not removed.
Also, once after a fight near a tree I was stuck in the tree. I could turn but not move.


I might be a bit late in reporting this, but this bug has been fixed. thanks for pointing out :)
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Re: My feedback

Postby BioHazardX » 26 Feb 2013, 21:26

Finally, I can't get past the green blobs in forest, all I'm able to do without dying is fighting the first ones and go back to the healing fountain. Characters reached level 2, I bought them clothes and they still seems too weak to go into the forest by themselve, it's kind of annoying me.


We are in two that think the game is too hard for a beginning.

It's better decrease the HPs for the slimes and for the spiders, because the first fights are too long and the enemies have got a lot of health and IMHO that's the balance problem:
- at lv.1, to kill a green slime you need at least 5 hits -----------> my idea, change to 3 hits;
- at lv.1, to kill a spider you need at least 9 hits ------------------> my idea, change to 5 hits.
If you fight two times against 3 slimes consequently you'll die surely, always if you haven't got a healing potion with you or if you are near the source.

The game feels like a one-button one at this point.)


True, you need too much XP to reach the level 2 in the game, and after this would be great if Bronann and Kalya learn a new strong skill but with but an high consumption of SP (it'll good to win a little easier against the first fenrir).

A CRITICAL BUG: on Windows with 0.5 version , if you buy the leather cloak for Kalya at the shop, the game instantly crashes.
----------EDIT--------------------
I've got always a crash for every item bought at the shop, in one of my two gameslots.
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Re: My feedback

Postby Bertram » 27 Feb 2013, 00:21

Hi BioHazardX,

It's better decrease the HPs for the slimes and for the spiders, because the first fights are too long and the enemies have got a lot of health and IMHO that's the balance problem:
- at lv.1, to kill a green slime you need at least 5 hits -----------> my idea, change to 3 hits;
- at lv.1, to kill a spider you need at least 9 hits ------------------> my idea, change to 5 hits.
If you fight two times against 3 slimes consequently you'll die surely, always if you haven't got a healing potion with you or if you are near the source.

Why not, an "easy mode" was even proposed, btw. I don't know how it could change the game, but could you have a try and tell me how you definitely feel about it?

Try changing the enemies HP in dat/actors/enemies.lua The file is pretty self-explanatory.
Does the game still feel sane at level 6, 8, 10?

True, you need too much XP to reach the level 2 in the game, and after this would be great if Bronann and Kalya learn a new strong skill but with but an high consumption of SP (it'll good to win a little easier against the first fenrir).

If the enemies are killed faster, the XP might not need more tweaking anymore. Note that for me, it's much harder to change the XP needed for next level than to tweak the enemies given XP. But you can always change that in the very same file and tell me?

A CRITICAL BUG: on Windows with 0.5 version , if you buy the leather cloak for Kalya at the shop, the game instantly crashes.
----------EDIT--------------------
I've got always a crash for every item bought at the shop, in one of my two gameslots.

Thanks, I do think Shirish reported something similar. I do think this bug is fixed in master. Can you try and tell me?

Best regards,
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Re: My feedback

Postby BioHazardX » 27 Feb 2013, 22:28

For now, I've just finished playing, and I said that the forest at the beginning of the game is the harder part of the whole game.

Why not, an "easy mode" was even proposed, btw. I don't know how it could change the game, but could you have a try and tell me how you definitely feel about it?


It would be nice having the possibility to set the difficulty you want as the start of the game...

Does the game still feel sane at level 6, 8, 10?


At level 1 every enemy is harder and the fights are a little long, I can't win two battles without healing the characters, so the best thing is earn a lot of drunes and then running to buy 10 healing potion (for the first fenrir I used 4 potions to defeat it, at level 2) and for the leather cloak and the new tunic for Bronann.

At level 4 the slimes and the spiders become a little easier to kill, but they're not still underestimated enemies. Better avoid fights against the snakes and instead I kill the spiders in the chest trap for the prismatic ring and then go to hunt some bats in the cave, near the statue, until I'll reach level 6.

At level 7 even the bats and the snakes become easier to kill, so I go to the second cave and kill all the enemies for unblock the exit. New abilities learned help very much to defeat the enemies faster and your characters own a lot of health.

At level 9 you feel very strong! The game is becoming easier, I've got almost 800 drunes and even the second and the third battles against the fenrir are easier than the first! Now, no scary.


In my opinion, this is enough to balancing the game:

1) Anticipate the Bronann's forward thrust ability after reaching the level 3 to level 2 and Kalya's defense ability after reaching level 4 to level 3. Players will be bored immediately if they'll click always the same one action (like me);
2) add the possibility to sell the default items worn by the characters at the beginning. I see you can't sell the Bronann's tunic;
3) set a maximum number spawns for the slimes generates by the mother. This boss is really a spamming-machine, I've killed it as first but in the battlefield there were still eight slimes alive and then I died. I suggest to choose a maximum value, like four slimes, and also fix well the slimes locations which aren't order and they occupy random and bad places in the map;
4) Fenrir was beaten three times. Nice boss, but......we've had enough of it!! :lol:

Thanks, I do think Shirish reported something similar. I do think this bug is fixed in master. Can you try and tell me?


I don't know how to build the SVN reposity...but there's no problem, it was already reported :)

Between nice game! I want to see the rest of the story and new features ^^
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Re: My feedback

Postby Bertram » 28 Feb 2013, 20:23

Hi BioHazardX,

At level 1 every enemy is harder and the fights are a little long, I can't win two battles without healing the characters, so the best thing is earn a lot of drunes and then running to buy 10 healing potion (for the first fenrir I used 4 potions to defeat it, at level 2) and for the leather cloak and the new tunic for Bronann.
At level 4 the slimes and the spiders become a little easier to kill, but they're not still underestimated enemies. Better avoid fights against the snakes and instead I kill the spiders in the chest trap for the prismatic ring and then go to hunt some bats in the cave, near the statue, until I'll reach level 6.
At level 7 even the bats and the snakes become easier to kill, so I go to the second cave and kill all the enemies for unblock the exit. New abilities learned help very much to defeat the enemies faster and your characters own a lot of health.
At level 9 you feel very strong! The game is becoming easier, I've got almost 800 drunes and even the second and the third battles against the fenrir are easier than the first! Now, no scary.

TBH, I meant more after your own modifications, but still, thanks for that kind of feedback, keep it coming even for later story parts.

1) Anticipate the Bronann's forward thrust ability after reaching the level 3 to level 2 and Kalya's defense ability after reaching level 4 to level 3. Players will be bored immediately if they'll click always the same one action (like me);

Sounds fair, and doesn't change anything actually. I'll do it.

2) add the possibility to sell the default items worn by the characters at the beginning. I see you can't sell the Bronann's tunic;

Nope, those are key items for story reasons.

3) set a maximum number spawns for the slimes generates by the mother. This boss is really a spamming-machine, I've killed it as first but in the battlefield there were still eight slimes alive and then I died. I suggest to choose a maximum value, like four slimes, and also fix well the slimes locations which aren't order and they occupy random and bad places in the map;

Eh eh :) This battle should be doable without a cap, and the fact I can still smell the sweat drops you had when fighting makes me think the desired effect was reached ;> So, I'd rather tweak it without adding a cap, especially if the slimes HP are lowered. On the other hand, on which border did the slimes location sound wrong?

4) Fenrir was beaten three times. Nice boss, but......we've had enough of it!! :lol:

Eh eh.

I'll look at adding a bit more XP to the beginning enemies and lower the first special skills learned but I definitely can't do much more without breaking other things, IMO. Thanks for the feedback and for playing, anyway.

Regards,
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Re: My feedback

Postby BioHazardX » 28 Feb 2013, 21:14

On the other hand, on which border did the slimes location sound wrong?


At the top of the screen, where they aren't in the ground but in air.

I'll look at adding a bit more XP to the beginning enemies and lower the first special skills learned but I definitely can't do much more without breaking other things, IMO. Thanks for the feedback and for playing, anyway.


That's good!!
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Re: My feedback

Postby MCMic » 02 Mar 2013, 17:32

Bertram {l Wrote}:
1) Anticipate the Bronann's forward thrust ability after reaching the level 3 to level 2 and Kalya's defense ability after reaching level 4 to level 3. Players will be bored immediately if they'll click always the same one action (like me);

Sounds fair, and doesn't change anything actually. I'll do it.

Sounds good, I felt very bad when finally reaching lvl 2 and discovering it did nothing (no new power, not enough more strength to survive more fights).
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Re: My feedback

Postby Bertram » 03 Mar 2013, 09:45

Hi,

It has been added on the git version.

Monster XP and certain ones HP have also been changed based on a hopefully better scale.

Regards,
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Re: My feedback

Postby shirish » 05 Mar 2013, 17:18

Hi all,
Just came from being out of town for couple of weeks. Am at the entrance of the village and hoping to see what new things Bertram and the rest of the team have cooked up. Also been reading up on Nik N's posts about the work he's doing about the minimap (honestly, didn't think it will take this long) . Oh well, lots to look forward to :)
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Re: My feedback

Postby Bertram » 05 Mar 2013, 22:11

Welcome back :)
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