Ideas for the next release?

Ideas for the next release?

Postby Tobbi » 15 Dec 2015, 16:59

Hello everyone,

since the release of SuperTux 0.4.0 is imminent (next Sunday), we'd like to look forward. As such, we'd like to ask you whether you have any ideas for the next version.

If you do, please do one of the following:

a) Go to https://github.com/SuperTux/supertux/issues and look through the open issues. If your issue hasn't been posted, create a new issue there or
b) Reply to this forum post with your idea.

You can suggest anything, even bigger changes can, and probably will, be considered. The release after 0.4.0 is years ahead of us.

Stay tuned for 0.4.0!

Thanks!
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby Hume2 » 17 Dec 2015, 19:49

I'll put there some suggestions form the old wiki those have some perspective.

New worlds:
-Jungle/tropical island
-Cave world
-Volcano island
-Desert island

Objects:
-Rotating platform and other rotating stuff
-Merchant or a shop (maybe increase the coin limit)

Badguys:
-Lava tier or lava fish
-A forest equivalent of stalactite, could look like a dirt ball hanging on a vine.
-A root that throws stones at Tux.

I have already prepared some of the needed sprites for those ideas, so many of them are just a coding challenge.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby darkylighty » 18 Dec 2015, 18:56

Well, originally, there where supposed to be eight worlds for supertux, but we only got close to develop two of them.
Personnally, I would aim for an haunted house or something, but I don't know how to make a new world map.

Think the marchand idea is not a bad idea.

more flowers could be added, but they would require a new resistance to each element. would be complexe.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby Hume2 » 18 Dec 2015, 20:24

Making worldmaps is easy, you just set the tileset to "images/worldmap.strf" and save the level as "worldmap.stwm".

OT: All of those world suggestions are quite vague and they are no plans, so we can make any worlds. There was already one empty discussion about the worlds and it didn't lead anywhere. Therefore I made a rule for suggesting worlds:

    If someone wants to suggest a world, then he should make it whole first (with some example levels) and then show it to the others. I really hate all those crappy world suggestions and the discussion arround, so this is a possible way how to improve that.
      Yes, you can work together with someone.
      Creating it on your git branch is the best way to show it to the others.
      If you can't do it, then please don't suggest any or work together with someone. There's no proper discussion without it.

All of those world suggestions don't obey this rule, so they can't be considered seriously.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby onpon4 » 18 Dec 2015, 21:00

I only have one suggestion: don't ask for suggestions. SuperTux doesn't need ideas. It just needs to be put together into a cohesive, complete game. Exactly how it goes together and exactly what its pieces are is really not all that important, and easy to fix after the fact if it causes a problem.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby Hume2 » 19 Dec 2015, 11:48

onpon4 {l Wrote}:I only have one suggestion: don't ask for suggestions. SuperTux doesn't need ideas. It just needs to be put together into a cohesive, complete game. Exactly how it goes together and exactly what its pieces are is really not all that important, and easy to fix after the fact if it causes a problem.


Then make suggestions how to put it together. Someone could thing that something is self-explanatory, but in fact, nothing is.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby onpon4 » 20 Dec 2015, 17:28

Then make suggestions how to put it together.

There are infinite possibilities. I'm implementing my vision in ReTux, and you're more than welcome to copy it, but what would be the point in that? Those of you working on SuperTux should generally work to make it what you want it to be.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby Krobonil » 20 Dec 2015, 19:59

I wish me some little cutscenes between the levels! :)
For example when Tux enters the cave or leave it alive.

And more good Soundtracks would be nice! ^^
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby charlie » 21 Dec 2015, 01:09

I think what onpon4 is getting at, which I agree with him, is that somebody (or several of you in agreement) needs to take charge of driving the vision of the game. There needs to be goals in terms of what you are trying to achieve. Originally it was a Tux-themed Mario clone. That was achieved with the 0.1 era. The 0.2 era seemed to be a few too many chefs trying to add sparkle to the game, but in different ways, and took quite some time to settle down. WHat is driving the current development? What do you want it to be that it currently isn't?
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby LMH » 28 Dec 2015, 08:01

I also agree with onpon4 and charlie; the project doesn't need a bunch of small suggestions for features but an overarching theme for the next release. New features will just naturally be a part of the development and dependent on who is actively working and their individual visions. However, these can be all geared toward a common goal. Honestly, this release feels a bit like a glorified developer snapshot with ill-defined goals (at least from an outsider's perspective), but given how overdue it is I'm willing to look the other way.

Perhaps a reasonable example of goals for next release would be: four complete and unique worldmaps, each with their own end boss, followed by a battle with Nolok concluding with the rescue of Penny. All tied together with a cohesive storyline (wouldn't it be great to have some closure?). Maybe throw in some new major features such as swimming or shops or a useful mechanic for coins. But don't fret the details too much at this point, tweaks and flair will naturally occur along the way. Once the major goals are met then the next milestone is released, any partial or incomplete features can wait for the next release (there are quite a few that made it through this time, but oh well). This is just an example, and whatever the decision is it should have as much input as possible without getting too overbearing. Perhaps this is a good place to start that conversation.

Of course the real challenge is committing to the major goals, whatever they may be. I think this step is critical to ensure more timeliness and focus for the next round.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby Wuzzy » 29 Dec 2015, 04:32

I currently have not many ideas or suggestions.

First: Fix bugs. xD
Second: Maybe rethink the way SuperTux treats level sets. I wonder if it still makes sense to have a single official “blessed” story line, and the rest goes into the giant “everything else” bag. Read more about my thoughts on the add-on system here: viewtopic.php?f=67&t=6696#p67068
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby MCMic » 30 Dec 2015, 05:39

I think the opposite, you should vet the contributed levels and expand the official story line. Put the forest world in it and start work on a third world.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby charlie » 30 Dec 2015, 17:09

Wuzzy {l Wrote}:I currently have not many ideas or suggestions.

First: Fix bugs. xD
Second: Maybe rethink the way SuperTux treats level sets. I wonder if it still makes sense to have a single official “blessed” story line, and the rest goes into the giant “everything else” bag. Read more about my thoughts on the add-on system here: viewtopic.php?f=67&t=6696#p67068

The thing about add on systems is that they aren't that inspiring to the casual player.

The casual player likes to start a story and follow it through to completion. If you just have 1 intro world and then throw players into a melting pot of add ons, then casual players will be mostly casting the game aside after the first world because they've (as far as they are concerned) completed the game.

I don't have statisics or studies to back this up, but I can tell you that anybody I know who has played Super Tux has only ever played the official levels, and I would expect the % of those for whom this is true is significant (if not the vast majority).
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby mteufel » 03 Jan 2016, 09:42

Regarding the story line: We actually have collected some ideas for the story line in the next release, documented on https://github.com/SuperTux/supertux/wiki/Milestone-3-Design-Document. We'd be really thankful about people contributing to that, and we would need the following things done:

  • Restructure Forest Island to have more of a story line: http://forum.freegamedev.net/viewtopic.php?f=67&t=6697
  • New graphics for new worlds: https://github.com/SuperTux/supertux/pull/278 (contribution in form of other tiles are welcome)
  • New music, welcome for Icy Island and Forest World right now (once we have a clear idea about World 3, you could also submit contributions for that)
  • Once Forest World is done, also new worldmap (that can be attached to the worldmap docuemnted in the link above) and levels for World 3

We've thought about adding small special features that only appear in one or two levels. However, to get all that done, at least all the coding part for the next release should be delayed until we've fixed https://github.com/SuperTux/supertux/milestones/0.4.1 (bugfix release).
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby Serano » 04 Jan 2016, 10:33

I think there shouldn't be so many types of badguys in the game, at least coding wise. We have a walking snowball, a bomb, for new worlds a simple sprite change is sufficient. Finishing forest world is more importantly. :)
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby mteufel » 05 Jan 2016, 18:44

Krobonil {l Wrote}:And more good Soundtracks would be nice! ^^

You're more than welcome to help. Personally I think we'd need a better soundtrack for the level "Shocking" in the forest world - currently that uses the soundtrack for cave levels but I don't think that fits into that level - however, I'd still like to hear about what others think. By the way, I'd like to see the source files for any contributions as that makes editing later on easier - especially for music or graphics.

Serano {l Wrote}:I think there shouldn't be so many types of badguys in the game, at least coding wise. We have a walking snowball, a bomb, for new worlds a simple sprite change is sufficient. Finishing forest world is more importantly. :)

This is also why we don't want any new world to be added right now - forest badguys are quite stable, they possibly still need some minor tweaks but it works for now.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby Dakal » 06 Jan 2016, 00:03

I want to say one thing to all contributors. :)
Do what the fuck you want!

Supertux is 13 years old and it's not finish, so don't listen peoples and all of you, do what the fuck you want!

Most of times in libre games there is no good way to start the work. Peoples like to discuss and discuss many hours with "how to contribute" and most of them think they have the best solutions. So, they are disagreed and it becomes pain in the ass to simply contribute. In fact the most important thing is just to start the work by the way you like (art, audio, code, etc).

Example: If i have free time i will contribute to supertux. But if you force me to remade the forest level (that i really don't care about) i'm not going to contribute to your vision of the game, as many contributors i just want to make what i like. So if you want to make an haunted house just make it, it's a good idea because it's yours. If the idea and the execution is obviously good it's gonna be in the game. If it's not, fuck it you don't need recognition of others people or something like this, isn' it? :)

Now, i have more than 10 years of contributions and i think DO is the best way.

PS: Excuse my French, i'm French.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby Tobbi » 06 Jan 2016, 13:31

@Krobonil: You're a composer, actually, we could use someone like you to create new / better tracks for the worlds.

Looking forward to anything you might be able to contribute!

--Tobbi
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby Krobonil » 24 Jan 2016, 23:00

Thanks ^^
It may take a while until me and my partner are ready but we're looking forward to compose new tracks.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby Tlaloc1 » 04 Feb 2016, 01:37

Maybe a way to share levels you made?
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby Tobbi » 08 Feb 2016, 00:03

Tlaloc1 {l Wrote}:Maybe a way to share levels you made?


That's something we've been thinking about. If all goes well, it might be integrated into the flexlay level editor. But this still requires a huge effort to code such a site.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby Tlaloc1 » 27 Feb 2016, 03:30

A world-map designer would be pretty neat.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby Hume2 » 17 Mar 2016, 07:25

The mono C# editor can already edit worldmaps. I'll try to implement it to the in-game level editor as well, but there are still more important upcomming base functions.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby RustyBox » 03 Apr 2016, 12:11

Maybe we could use different soundtracks in the worldmaps.
For example: The music changes when you reach the ghost forest in world 2.
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Re: Ideas for the next release?

Postby brmbrmcar » 03 Apr 2016, 13:38

Make a flower that has no special power but to protect Tux more. It would give him a white hat.
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