Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby Julius » 16 Apr 2019, 21:13

Edit: test it here: https://mumble.freegamedev.net

Anyone got experience running a server for Mumble VoIP communication? https://wiki.mumble.info/wiki/Main_Page

Might be a nice service to run on FreeGameDev and there is now a really nice new web-client for it:
https://github.com/Johni0702/mumble-web

as well as a cool IRC bridge:
https://github.com/SFTtech/sftmumblebot
Edit: please Thumbs-up this feature request here: https://github.com/42wim/matterbridge/issues/800
Edit: Two other intesting bridge projects:
https://github.com/whitekiba/irc-jabber-mumble-bridge (Mumble, Jabber, Teamspeak and more)
https://github.com/narenniranjan/broadcast (IRC, Mumble, maybe Discord)

Generally the ecosystem is quite rich:
https://wiki.mumble.info/wiki/3rd_Party_Applications
https://wiki.mumble.info/wiki/Games
but also a lot of outdated stuff, so I am wondering if anyone here has experience running such a server and could give some recommendations?

I am currently tending towards the keep-it-simple option and run a Grumble https://github.com/mumble-voip/grumble instance as I don't think getting into complex remote management of servers etc. will be required and it seems like Grumble directly supports the websockets needed by the above webclient... I also suspect that it is a bit more lightweight on server resources compared to the official Murmur server app.

Anyways, suggestions and help appreciated :heart:
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby Julius » 16 Apr 2019, 22:47

This might also be cool to notify XMPP channels:
https://github.com/Kirmark/mumble_notice

There is also a cool (but not actively maintained) Android client:
https://github.com/acomminos/Plumble
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby Arthur » 16 Apr 2019, 23:45

I've been running one for a couple years. Dunno what to say, it just works.
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby fluffrabbit » 17 Apr 2019, 18:19

I've never run a Mumble server, but I have used the desktop and (very outdated) mobile client. The web client sounds cool. Though I thought you had limited server resources, which precluded you from hosting repos.
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby Julius » 17 Apr 2019, 19:00

Murmur seems to need surprisingly little resources, but the main issue with hosting git repos is the storage space on the SSD drive of the root server I rent. I have a bit more space on the main server, but that one is managed and basically only runs php (and simple NodeJS) websites.
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby fluffrabbit » 17 Apr 2019, 19:12

Julius {l Wrote}:Murmur seems to need surprisingly little resources, but the main issue with hosting git repos is the storage space on the SSD drive of the root server I rent. I have a bit more space on the main server, but that one is managed and basically only runs php (and simple NodeJS) websites.

Gotcha. Maybe run a Git server on the root server and use PHP as a network drive bridge? Also related. EDIT: Also this. Maybe one of the GitHub clones has a way of backing up a repo on a remote server, then deleting it locally, and redirecting to the remote server when pushes and pulls are sent to the GitHub clone. EDIT 2: This looks like a pure LAMP code host.

As for P2P voice chat, it's magic.
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby Julius » 17 Apr 2019, 20:06

This is getting off-topic and the links you put are all abandoned code (last real commit 8 years ago) and the last one is just the Typo3 CMS?
Anyways, I am open to ideas but ultimately I think I'll wait for Gogs or Gitea to implement user disk quotas as everything else will be a ugly and difficult to maintain hack ;)
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby fluffrabbit » 17 Apr 2019, 20:29

Julius {l Wrote}:This is getting off-topic and the links you put are all abandoned code (last real commit 8 years ago) and the last one is just the Typo3 CMS?
Anyways, I am open to ideas but ultimately I think I'll wait for Gogs or Gitea to implement user disk quotas as everything else will be a ugly and difficult to maintain hack ;)

Well, I just rigged up an audio buffer system with realloc and got it right on the first try, having never used C memory management before, so I think anything is possible if you approach it like a skid. PHP is powerful and has done less in the past. The only reason I care about the idea is because, as you said before, there are "GitHub refugees", which is sad but true, considering how many Git hosting sites are utter garbage. The software they run is solid, but either site policies or ads or security issues all end up making GitHub my go-to, unfortunately.

The Mumble thing is awesome, and it would be nice to talk about something on Mumble other than online games for a change.
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby Julius » 17 Apr 2019, 22:20

Made some promising progress in setting it up, but it seems like the Grumble backend is either not yet able to do the direct connection to the new web interface, or I made some mistake.
But after testing Grumble a bit though the Mumble desktop client, it seems like it really provides only the most basic functionality and is thus not really suited.

So I'll try getting the official Murmur backend to work sometimes this week. With the official demo server, my web client already works nicely. So overall it looks promising!
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby Julius » 17 Apr 2019, 23:07

Dogfooding the Kanboard that I am also working on:
FGD Mumble Implementation Kanboard
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby fluffrabbit » 17 Apr 2019, 23:22

Hmm, "dogfood", that's not a term I thought I'd hear around here. I find the visual layout distracting and confusing, but there seem to be a number of items on the to-do graph. I don't know why there isn't a package to just get all the basic stuff running at once.
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby Julius » 17 Apr 2019, 23:28

It's a Kanban board... you either like it or hate it :) There are plenty of other ways to view the issue tracker in Kanboard though.

Regarding this Mumble setup... lots of additional 3rd party stuff and the web-client is rather bleeding edge. The Murmur server itself seems to be very easy to install via the package manager in Debian.
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby fluffrabbit » 17 Apr 2019, 23:36

The 3rd party stuff is what I wonder about. It sounds nice to have Mumble integrated with all these other services, but XMPP and IRC and fediverse and and and... I get it, you don't want people to overlook something from one service when they're on another service, but there's just a lot of different services and protocols. Are you going to host a SIP server next so we can cyber?
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby Julius » 18 Apr 2019, 21:40

I think a service is only good if it gets used... and this includes building bridges (practically and metaphorically) to other services, especially those non-libre ones people mostly use (Discord, Teamspeak etc.). But if Matterbridge implements it, that this is just a minor additional configuration as I am planning to run that anyways.

Anyways, got very basic functionality working with the Grumble backend. I have not yet figured out how to create rooms and such with it. It seems this is actually not yet implemented in Grumble? I'll try to figure this out.

You can test the web-client by going to https://mumble.freegamedev.net (just choose a user name and connect)
You can also connect via regular Mumble client with the default port (64738) and "grumble.freegamedev.net" (you might have to accept a self-signed certificate).

I am a bit hesitant to switch to the Murmur backend as it is significantly more complicated to get it to work with the web-client... so I hope that Grumble gets an update with the already in a PR available configuration changes soon.
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby fluffrabbit » 18 Apr 2019, 21:53

I guess it's all a matter of personal taste whether stability or bridges to proprietary services matters more. Personally I feel that losers who can't troubleshoot and appreciate the nuances of their own software experience shouldn't be allowed online. Like, make them earn an FCC license or something. But again, personal taste.

The web client is totally broken for me. I don't even see a page title. Going to try it through Plumble now.

EDIT: It shows the FGD server as online with 1/1000 users, 188ms - 227ms ping, but it perpetually says "Connecting to grumble.freegamedev.net 64738". No dice.

EDIT 2: The web client uses tricky web voodoo and needs Chromium or something.
Last edited by fluffrabbit on 18 Apr 2019, 23:35, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby Julius » 18 Apr 2019, 22:08

fluffrabbit {l Wrote}:
The web client is totally broken for me. I don't even see a page title.


Really? I tried it with Firefox and Chrome and both were working without any issue. Do you block Javascript? Obviously it needs that :)

Edit: Chromium also works, Falkon apparently not.
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby Julius » 18 Apr 2019, 22:10

fluffrabbit {l Wrote}:EDIT: It shows the FGD server as online with 1/1000 users, 188ms - 227ms ping, but it perpetually says "Connecting to grumble.freegamedev.net 64738". No dice.


Strange, I tried it with Pumble 5 minutes ago and it was working fine :shock:

Edit: after restarting the server it worked again for me.

Edit2: so the issue with the Android Pumble client seems to be that only version 3.2.0 from the Playstore works, but not the 3.3.0-rc1 from Fdroid.
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby fluffrabbit » 18 Apr 2019, 23:16

Well, that was interesting. The web client works, not without minor issues, but it works. The desktop client is from 2012 and uses Qt 4, so its chat box is broken. Plumble has been abandoned and gives Grumble all kinds of problems.
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby Julius » 18 Apr 2019, 23:18

Tested it a bit with fluffrabbit... thanks a lot!

Still serveral issues, and in general it doesn't play nice with the desktop and Android clients. Once reason might be that my Traefik reverse proxy right now doesn't support UDP connections. This is about to change with Traefik version 2.0 though (currently Alpha4), so there is hope.

So I'll keep the web-client & Grumble up for now as it uses next to no system resources (<10MB RAM when idle), but it will take some time before this gets fully usable.
Edit: Will likely be disabled in July when my current hosting setup changes. If by then the use-case is better, I might set it up again on the new server.
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Re: Running a Mumble server (Murmur/Grumble)?

Postby Julius » 29 Apr 2019, 20:48

Had a look at the lighweight uMurmur server. Seems also suitable for what I have in mind, but allows basic channel settings etc.
But it doesn't support websockets, so I would need to change the setup of Mumble-web to include the proxy. Seems doable, but low priority for now.
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