Track: Dyson Speedway

Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby Heuchi1 » 22 Jun 2021, 09:57

RX1 {l Wrote}:The rather long loading time is not related to the details of the track. The polygon count is around 100.000 tris (130.000 in blend file, but not all of that is exported). As far as I remember Cocoa Temple for example is around 250.000 tris.
The reason for the longer loading time is related to the complexity of the driveline in combination with the length of the track and the required number of checklines. If I delete all additional drivelines and keep only the main one, the track also loads in one or two seconds. Like I described before:
RX1 {l Wrote}:Dirvelines - loading delay:
Because of the pipes and alternative lines, my track needs many additional drivelines. […] I am not sure, but maybe this is related to the following message which STK writes, when loading the track: "[info ] CheckLine: Object crosses line, but wrong height ...". The more drivelines I have, the more of these messages it generates. It would help if I would understand what exactly this message means. I suspect it might be related to checklines that are not touching any driveline.


I think the long loading time has nothing to do with the checklines at all, but the message you mentioned lead me to the real reason:
When loading a track, void DriveGraph::computeChecklineRequirements() is called and it traverses the whole node tree to find the last checkline a kart had to cross before a given quad. This is done recursively but no check is done, if a certain node has been visited before. This function will literally travel all(!) possible ways. So if you have a lot of alternative drivelines it can take some time.

For a quick fix I added a check if a node was already visited: the current version runs about 3 to 4 seconds on my system for your track, with the change it runs less than 10ms.

I don't know if this can have any side effects because I'm not familiar with this part of STK. More specifically, I don't know if grouped checklines have the same number internally. If that was not the case, my new version is not guaranteed to produce the exact same result than the current one. Although the result of the current version would also seem to depend on the order of the successors. So some testing would be good.

I'm not sure this is the right place for those details, but I don't know another way to reach RX1. You don't seem to be on Discord?
If you can compile your own client, you could try my fix, or you could send me the most complex version of your track and I could see how long it takes to load.
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby RX1 » 22 Jun 2021, 11:04

benau {l Wrote}:rx1 which blender version are you using ...

I am still using Blender v2.79b and the respective scripts from "blender_26" folder of the SuperTuxKart Media Repository (Revision 18272). This is still the same setup RuJo & I used for Toy Block Raceway. Last time we tried the newer scripts (from "blender_28" folder) with new Blender version it didnt work for for us and I also heard that another STK player and track author had issues exporting his track with Blender 2.8. So I kept using the running setup for Dyson Speedway.

benau {l Wrote}:the check plane can be calcuated with drive node normal by the way, so you can still use line in blender ...

What is the drive node normal and where can I find it? Can it be used to increase the checkline height for my track in current STK 1.2 version? Do I need the newer Blender version and STK export scripts for that?
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby benau » 22 Jun 2021, 11:23

Don't need to worry about 1.2 because it will be dead soon anyway
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby Heuchi1 » 22 Jun 2021, 11:36

I've created a pull request.
I now understand how ChecklineRequirements are done and have a save way to greatly speed up this process.
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby RX1 » 22 Jun 2021, 14:06

Heuchi1 {l Wrote}:I'm not sure this is the right place for those details, but I don't know another way to reach RX1. You don't seem to be on Discord?

I have just created an account at libera.chat IRC network to join #supertuxkart channel again. You will not find me on proprietary centralized systems like Discord.

Heuchi1 {l Wrote}:If you can compile your own client, you could try my fix, or you could send me the most complex version of your track and I could see how long it takes to load.

I can compile software if I a have detailed list of instructions that includes all required packages. I never compile STK before. Probably its easier if I upload a special version of my track to my cloud for you. I could export one with further additional drivelines, which are currently ignored, that takes over a minute to load. But I think a difference from 3 or 4 seconds to 10 ms is obvious enough already.


Something I did not mention so far, is that I had issues getting some additional drivelines to work.
There are a few things I figured out:
  • It seems to be important that additional drivelines should not start in upside down or vertical sections. Thats why I had to extend a few drivelines.
  • If it still doesn't work, sometimes it helps to move the start of the additional driveline further up or down the main driveline. Even a single segment of the main driveline can help.
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby Heuchi1 » 22 Jun 2021, 14:28

RX1 {l Wrote}:I can compile software if I a have detailed list of instructions that includes all required packages. I never compile STK before. Probably its easier if I upload a special version of my track to my cloud for you. I could export one with further additional drivelines, which are currently ignored, that takes over a minute to load. But I think a difference from 3 or 4 seconds to 10 ms is obvious enough already.


I think it would be quite interesting to see if I can load such a version without problems to see how much faster it really is.
Unfortunately I won't be able to really test your track, because my driving skills are just not sufficient. ;)
That's why I thought it would be better if testing was done by "pro" drivers.
On the other hand I really do think my PR doesn't break anything. But let's see what Benau says.

So if you have a link, I'll be happy to try.
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby tempAnon093 » 23 Jun 2021, 00:18

Now that the code is merged (nice!), I can grab the latest git release ( https://github.com/supertuxkart/stk-code/releases , "Latest preview release" above 1.2) and do some testing on main tracks and add-ons. :)
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby Heuchi1 » 23 Jun 2021, 07:18

tempAnon093 {l Wrote}:Now that the code is merged (nice!), I can grab the latest git release ( https://github.com/supertuxkart/stk-code/releases , "Latest preview release" above 1.2) and do some testing on main tracks and add-ons. :)


That would be great.
However, looking at the dates in the file names, I think only "win", "switch" and "mac" versions include my PR. Linux and apk packages seem to be older and probably won't have it yet. So, if you're on Linux or Android, you might still have to build yourself.
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby benau » 23 Jun 2021, 10:50

Linux and android are manually Image because of complexity

wine the win build in linux should work too because it's Image with mingw

By the way check plane code is under way......
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby RX1 » 24 Jun 2021, 18:35

I have tested the recent Windows preview built with the special test version of Dyson Speedway (with 11 more additional drivelines).
At the first start it took about 10 seconds to load, maybe because there were some STK libraries that were not loaded. Then I went back to menu and started it again and the track loaded almost instantly (less than two seconds). In STK v1.2 that version of the track would take about a minute to load on that System. This confirms the improvements Heuchi was talking about.

I also checked all (additional) drivelines for bad reset sections (parts of the track where the kart doesn't get reset close the same place, but (a lot) further back) and everything worked at least as well as in version 1.2. So in case of Dyson Speedway, Heuchis new code works correctly. Well done! :cool:
I also ran a few standard tracks and everything seemed normal, too, but I have not explicitly tested the tracks.

Thanks a lot at Benau, too, for making it available quickly and for working at the new 3D drivelines! :)
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby benau » 25 Jun 2021, 07:01

it's now working with latest git stk-code, but if you export with latest exporter script 3d checkline will be treated as 2d in <= 1.2 stk, so maybe you can update your addons after 1.3 is released Image
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby sridharkumar » 29 Jun 2021, 19:55

Finally it work on my Computer! The problem is i did not restart my computer ;)
Last edited by sridharkumar on 30 Jun 2021, 06:09, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby puzlanchik » 29 Jun 2021, 22:29

This is a great track! Thx! Live long and prosper! :heart:

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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby RX1 » 03 Jul 2021, 23:32

sridharkumar {l Wrote}:... The problem is i did not restart my computer ;)

Honestly? :think: :D
However, the investigations done because of your issue led to some nice improvements, which in future will not only help Dyson Speedway to start faster, but also other tracks. :D

puzlanchik {l Wrote}:This is a great track! Thx! Live long and prosper!

Thanks a lot for playing! :) The more people install, play and enjoy the track the more all that time and work I invested feels worth it and motivates me to realize further projects for STK.

I know this is by far not a classic STK track and the first laps may be difficult for some players, but I hope that it will add some new excitement to STK after all. :cool:

eltomito {l Wrote}:I tried your track. It's fantastic including the music. Great job,!

Thanks for mentioning the music. I'm very happy about finding this cool "Retro Game Music Pack" (https://opengameart.org/content/5-chiptunes-action). The author Juhani Junkala did not only do a great job by composing the music, the sound tracks in that pack can also be looped and joined seamlessly! :cool: In my case I combined two of the tracks by using Audacity.
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby tlbomb » 14 Aug 2021, 19:46

This is tlbomb to Bridge;
I played this track once and.... WOW.
The track's graphic design was just mind blowing and would match a revolution in STK's graphics :o
Just a little thing I'd like to mention: the track is somewhat confusing and I ended up falling into holes or crashing against invisible walls.
Anyway: GOOD JOB :D
With worst regards you can think of... No, I was just sarcastic *cough*
With BEST regards,
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby sridharkumar » 17 Aug 2021, 15:34

This track is very great. A LOT better than some main tracks. But there are only two problems as far as i can see.

1. When i use zipper when going uphill, i fly into the air when it flattens and it automatically resets me. Can you give that texture a gravity option? Or maybe slow down that zipper to a speed where i keep touching the road.

2. Seems like turning is very very hard on "some" textures especially when I am at highest speed. Did you flip the normal to opposite side? lol
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby tempAnon093 » 19 Aug 2021, 00:45

sridharkumar {l Wrote}:2. Seems like turning is very very hard on "some" textures especially when I am at highest speed. Did you flip the normal to opposite side? lol

It will probably help if you can name which textures or where they are in the track. There's lots of them!
If it's the two sections where you slide and can't turn for a few seconds, I'm guessing that was done on purpose as a challenge.
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby sridharkumar » 19 Aug 2021, 13:37

tempAnon093 {l Wrote}: If it's the two sections where you slide and can't turn for a few seconds, I'm guessing that was done on purpose as a challenge.

Well it can be a challenge. But, it could also be a mistake too. Because that happened to my own track evergreen forest.

The point is, if you wanted to make the road both sides visible, usually you double it and flip the normal opposite side. And that's what creates the problem in turning.

I think its happening because there is some sort of gravity problem when you double the road. To solve this problem just move the duplicate road a VERY little distance away from the actual road so that players wont notice the gap.... and it would make to turn easily.
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby Alayan » 10 Sep 2021, 19:40

From the video, the track looks great, probably one of the best add-ons out there.

But indeed too wild, too far in the experimental madness for the base game I think.

Nonetheless, I think you could well be able to make a track good enough for the base game, given enough work and care. The islands project probably wants to do too much at once, but with a well-defined design another track could be of high enough quality. I hope to see more projects from you, and discussion too of early draft to design things that would integrate well in the game.
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Re: Track: Dyson Speedway

Postby Bird » 14 Sep 2021, 07:58

What about a name change? This track deserves something more gigantic. Like Dyson Space Sphere...

This is a challenging track, where the racers have to do quite some laps to get used to. I've noticed something at the place, where I jump into the tube with the 4 boost lanes, that can be driven upside down. Aiming the jump towards the tube is sometimes a bit tricky, as minor differences lead to the kart flying all over the place at this jump. However I think it resets me too quickly, even if the jump wasn't perfectly aimed at the tube, I would have been able to go on. Maybe even hit one of the three bananas at each side, but I would have been able to go on. So the automatic reset is a bit too conservative there.
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