[important] We need a music for Chocolate

[samuncle]

Hello everybody

Chocolate, our first true next gen track needs a music.
I would go for something similar to Samba since the track is in south america. It should be cheerful and happy .

My main problem is, I'm a developer and an artist but I have no idea how to compose a music especially a soundtrack .

That's why I'm asking some help to our awesome community.

If you are interested here is some inspiration
Rio soundtrack https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lnHcUkAtZoo
The classical kart game music cliché https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZTtRfRW94U

If nobody make a new music, well I will use the old one. But it would be too bad .

[0zone0ne]

I really appreciate that you're not just going for stereotypical jungle music. I think this approach will make things more interesting.
Personally, I was thinking something along the lines of Mario Kart 8's Water Park: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hNDGhQvnZ8
I could also try for a more jazz-like approach, like DK Jungle from Mario Kart 7 (this one I really like): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSGmNs1M_og
Let me know what you think. I'll do some quick drafts in the meantime to get some ideas down.

[samuncle]

Hello

I prefer Mario Kart 8's water park theme. It's pretty similar to what I had in mind .

[Totoplus62]

https://www.jamendo.com/en/track/459672/subela (cc-by)
https://www.jamendo.com/en/track/509674/black-samba (cc-by-sa)

[0zone0ne]

So far, I've got the first sections planned out. I want to know if this is what you are looking for before I continue too far. Please tell me what you think, and everyone's opinions are welcome.

[samuncle]

I like it

Maybe a bit more samba, we need to recognize south America, but I think it's better than the current one .

[0zone0ne]

Just cleaned up the melody a little bit, it was kind of all over the place before.
I'll add another section based around percussion instruments to add to the samba feel (I can't add them into the sections I've already done, because if I add any more instruments it'll start to sound muddy).

[GunChleoc]

Good start

The steel pans could use a bit of polish though to make them sound more natural. I know that's not easy electronically.

[jymis]

You're on the right track.
Maybe do not add more high-pitched sounds but add a quiet passage.

[WillemS]

I think this is now already a really good soundtrack! Mainly because it is so happy I think, and because it stays in your head :P

[Auria]

Pretty nice start, well done

[0zone0ne]

Thanks food the positive feedback everyone!
I finished all the sections and made the music loopable. If you think it's good enough I can get on to polishing it up (like fixing the steel drums) and getting the final version out.

[GeekPenguinBR]

Hi!

Well, as I said before, I'm from Brazil and samba is a Brazilian musical style. I'm an graphic artist and a musician too. So, I could compose a Brazilian song, but, the question is: where exactly is the country of "Chocolate"? Is it that new fictional country called Valverde? If so, where's Valverde?

As a South American, I can help you about local aspects including culture, architecture, vegetation and animals to keep the accuracy of the environment avoiding the inclusion of non native species like lions, tigers, zebras, rhinos, giraffes, gorillas and other African or Asian species as well the inclusion of elements from other cultures that have nothing to do with the region. Eg: Cuban and Mexican.

Actually, I have an idea for a complete profile of the new fictional country, including a map, flag, economy and some other aspects like vegetation and fauna. I may post my conception of map, flag, national symbol. My idea about Valverde is an insular country near Venezuela, Guyana and Trinidad and Tobago (my track "Port", already modelled and currently being texturized, is placed in a country like these). In this case, the soundtrack should be caribbean instead Brazilian. So, Ozone's song is already quite good for the purpose.

About my collaboration: do you have you some interest in this kind of cultural contribution?

[GunChleoc]

I'm always in favour of cultural accuracy. Having a local contribute is good, because this will do away with clichés/errors.

There's a snafu in the pitch somewhere - it sounds as if the overall pitch drops after the 1st section, but it doesn't - probably one of the instruments is off-key. The background strings, maybe?

[0zone0ne]

There's a snafu in the pitch somewhere - it sounds as if the overall pitch drops after the 1st section, but it doesn't - probably one of the instruments is off-key. The background strings, maybe?

I think I see where the problem is. The music is all in E major, apart from section 2, which modulates to the relative key, C# minor. However, not all of the instruments modulate. The steel drums stay in E major, and during the second half of the section, so do the strings and background piano. Does the first half of the section seem any less out-of-pitch than the second half to you?

[samuncle]

@GeekPenguinBR

Your suggestions to help us are welcome however it's 6 months late ^^. I'm sorry but chocolate is considered as finished. There is still some minor details that might be changed but the vaaaaaaaaast majority will stay the same and I won't change it. I already remade this track 3 times.
What you are suggesting is made typically before starting to make the track ^^. I made many research about south America in general, Amazonian forest, the spanish conquistadors, the countless revolutions and putsch, cocoa trees, etc. I even visited a full scale central American jungle in a greenhouse and took hundred of photo (I know this isn't south America, and If you offers me a plane ticket to go visiting the real amazonian forest I will be happy .

As you said, chocolate is located in a fictional country called Valverde. Valverde isn't in a precise location. It's a "typical" south American country (with some landmarks of central America).
Currently the country starts with a desert (it will be probably where Hacienda will be). It stretches in the south of stk's planet with a big tropical/rain forest. There is some island, maybe the Track Island will be near this region however this is not sure. One of the biggest achievement in the country is Espinoza canal built in 1910 that allow boats to travel from an ocean to the other side without making a huge detour.

As you can see there is numerous real world references but everything is fictional (and that's the objective).

As a South American, I can help you about local aspects including culture, architecture, vegetation and animals to keep the accuracy of the environment avoiding the inclusion of non native species like lions, tigers, zebras, rhinos, giraffes, gorillas and other African or Asian species as well the inclusion of elements from other cultures that have nothing to do with the region. Eg: Cuban and Mexican.

I agree with you at some point. The main purpose of supertuxkart is entertainment, not historical accuracy ^^. We try to be accurate with some stuff like avoiding fauna and vegetation from other continent. For instance you won't see cactus from the Val verde desert region (where hacienda is) in the jungle and vice versa.

However there are some overlaps, like Azetec pyramid with Inca wall ^^. Palm trees are pretty generic and they will be used in other tracks like Egypt.

Actually, I have an idea for a complete profile of the new fictional country, including a map, flag, economy and some other aspects like vegetation and fauna. I may post my conception of map, flag, national symbol

It's exactly what we did during the research process 6 months ago ^^. A fictional country with a story, a flag etc.

Valverde's national flag

. My idea about Valverde is an insular country near Venezuela, Guyana and Trinidad and Tobago (my track "Port", already modelled and currently being texturized, is placed in a country like these). In this case, the soundtrack should be caribbean instead Brazilian. So, Ozone's song is already quite good for the purpose.

The goal of Val verde is to avoid targeting a specific country, however the inspiration came from a bunch of central/south Americans country ^^, not one.

We are aware of the fact that south America is composed with many country with their own stories and cultures. But we can't/don't want to start to represent each country, that's why using fictional country is useful. Don't worry we will do the same thing with other regions of the world .

About my collaboration: do you have you some interest in this kind of cultural contribution?

I would like to make a collaboration with you . But don't expect that we will change everything. Chocolate is finished. Also if you want to help us keep in mind we are trying to make a mash up between several different region rather than an 100% accurate depiction of the country.

@GunChleoc
You should think more about an amusement park. Imagine If you where in charge of making an amusement park with a south american area, your objective would be to "capture" the spirit of south america. With let's say a greenhouse with a jungle, a Samba Plaza with nightly spectacle and people dancing, a roller coaster in a maya pyramid. We know in reality this is separated by hundred and hundred of km, but in these case you don't have the choice. Well a track in stk is pretty similar to that .

[samuncle]

Another quick reply.

@GeekPenguinBR if you want to make a samba music for chocolate and if other member of the dev team agree I will gladly accept . But keep in mind, making a soundtrack is different than making a regular music. It should fit with the idea of a race + the music should be "loopable" and not annoying since you will ear it often.

@0zone0ne, DON'T PANIC :P. If GeekPenguinBR makes a cool samba music for chocolate I have already a golden proposition for your music. It will be in the track "The island". I think it will fit perfectly and trust me this track will become epic it will feature PSTA (and nope it's not Pinellas Suncoast Transit Authority :P). It might be the next one that will be converted. Because, vegetation is "similar" to chocolate (palm tree, grass, and flowers).

[GeekPenguinBR]

"Your suggestions to help us are welcome however it's 6 months late ^^. I'm sorry but chocolate is considered as finished."

Good but, I mean suggestions about the profile of Valverde, not "Chocolate" specifically.

I'm referring to the country's economy (what Valverde produces, what natural resources it have, etc.), official language, ethnic culture (is Valverde mostly influenced by Spanish, native or any other external culture? The establishment names are written in Spanish, English or another language?), regimen and infrastructure including port, airports, energy (what kind of energy is most abundant in Valverde? Hydroelectric, nuclear, thermic, eolic?), etc. I would like to see some tracks exploring this new part (Valverde) of STK universe. I have some ideas for tracks exploring mining, hydroelectric dam, railway, airport and a militar base. I can release an art next week if somebody have interest to make a track based on one or two of these instalations above mentioned.

"But we can't/don't want to start to represent each country, that's why using fictional country is useful."
Yes and I prefer a fictional country instead real countries. Good initiative! I was thinking about Valverde as some kind of Cuba, not exactly a South American country.

An important point:
"One of the biggest achievement in the country is Espinoza canal built in 1910 that allow boats to travel from an ocean to the other side without making a huge detour."

I didn't know this. So, this locate Valverde in one of these two points:
1.In Panama (as if the Panama canal doesn't exist or it name was "Espinoza"); or
2.Somewhere in Argentina crossing Chile too.

As you said above "Valverde isn't in a precise location", but In my imagination, the perfect place for Valverde should be Panama or somewhere above Venezuela.

Well, I have many ideas for tracks. Actually, I'm planning to make my own tracks (now, I'm finishing "Port") but I can collaborate with art concept for tracks based on my list if somebody have an interest to make one or more of my suggestions. My list includes a rocket center, a "soviet" town, Greek Island, 1001 Nights (but somebody posted the idea before), a medieval castle (including a cavern and a dragon - Konqi - inside) and many others.
I will post my suggestions in the proper topic ("Track Ideas").

"If GeekPenguinBR makes a cool samba music for chocolate I have already a golden proposition for your music."
Ozone's song is pretty good for "Chocolate". I could make a samba song in the case of a tracked based on Rio de Janeiro, from where this style comes. Actually, samba is not so popular in many (most) parts of Brazil.

"keep in mind, making a soundtrack is different than making a regular music. It should fit with the idea of a race + the music should be "loopable" and not annoying since you will ear it often."

Yes, of course. Currently, I'm working (mentally) on two tracks: "Holiday on Port", based on Popeye's song and U.S. Navy Song "Anchors Aweigh" (in the case I don't use some caribbean type song for my port) and another song for my brother's track.

[samuncle]

I'm referring to the country's economy (what Valverde produces, what natural resources it have, etc.), official language, ethnic culture (is Valverde mostly influenced by Spanish, native or any other external culture? The establishment names are written in Spanish, English or another language?), regimen and infrastructure including port, airports, energy (what kind of energy is most abundant in Valverde? Hydroelectric, nuclear, thermic, eolic?), etc. I would like to see some tracks exploring this new part (Valverde) of STK universe. I have some ideas for tracks exploring mining, hydroelectric dam, railway, airport and a militar base. I can release an art next week if somebody have interest to make a track based on one or two of these instalations above mentioned.

It's what we did 6 months ago, maybe with less details. The names are written in spanish however if we make a Val verde, "Rio de Janeiro city like" it will be in Portuguese.
The game doesn't explore only Val verde ^^, for instance the track old mine is in a mine but not located in Val Verde. At the end there will be only maybe 2 or 3 tracks located in this country and some cross references in other (like an advertising for travel agency).
You can release your work, every concept art is welcome however you should keep in mind that stk is an adventure around the world and not just only Val Verde. We have other fictional country, cites, like Las Dunas, Berglidorf, Jerico Natural Park, etc.
We might do tracks in an airport or a railway station but they won't be in Valverde (a track in a train would be funny :P).

Yes and I prefer a fictional country instead real countries. Good initiative! I was thinking about Valverde as some kind of Cuba, not exactly a South American country.

An important point:
"One of the biggest achievement in the country is Espinoza canal built in 1910 that allow boats to travel from an ocean to the other side without making a huge detour."

I didn't know this. So, this locate Valverde in one of these two points:
1.In Panama (as if the Panama canal doesn't exist or it name was "Espinoza"); or
2.Somewhere in Argentina crossing Chile too.

It's up to your imagination. A piece of art is finished in the mind of the spectator .

Well, I have many ideas for tracks. Actually, I'm planning to make my own tracks (now, I'm finishing "Port") but I can collaborate with art concept for tracks based on my list if somebody have an interest to make one or more of my suggestions. My list includes a rocket center, a "soviet" town, Greek Island, 1001 Nights (but somebody posted the idea before), a medieval castle (including a cavern and a dragon - Konqi - inside) and many others.
I will post my suggestions in the proper topic ("Track Ideas").

I strongly suggest to group ideas into one track. Like a Rocket center in a soviet town during the space race, with rockets taking off in the background. That might be a beautiful landscape.
But keep in mind. It took me ~6 month to achieve chocolate (it was a lot of trial and error and learning how to use our new engine). If you want to make a track well sure you can but you should focus on one track because everybody has awesome ideas. The main problem is the time to turn them into reality.
Also keep in mind we try to be neutral. No political undertones . You can make some references but you must not take a real political party or a real politician.

[samuncle]

You might be interested by this wiki page
http://supertuxkart.sourceforge.net/Universe

If you want to continue the discussion please create another topic about stk's universe. Let's focus here on Chocolate's soundtrack

[GeekPenguinBR]

Again. I strongly support the Ozone's song BUT, I think that, due to the nature of the track, the song should sound more like a songtrack for adventure. Sometinhing like a mix of Ozone's song with musical elements of Johnny Quest* intro theme. What do you think?

(*) Johnny Quest is an old cartoon from the 1960's available on some cable TV channels.

[samuncle]

Honestly I'm in favor of putting Ozone's song in the track Island and your samba song in the track jungle.

When I think about it, Ozone's song fits more for The island and yours hypothetic one for chocolate.
I'm working on island right now and this track deserve an original soundtrack. Currently it's something taken from Jamendo. We try to avoid that

[0zone0ne]

I at least want to see what you're doing with the island track before we decide what music to use. I don't think that having multiple tracks with similarly themed music is a very good idea, so I may be able to produce something based off a different style that still fits the environment. Perhaps some kind of surf music?

[0zone0ne]

I think I managed to track down the cause of the discord in the second section. It was due to the background piano playing an incorrect chord. :s

[GunChleoc]

Here is my feedback anyway, since I compiled it before reading your post:

I think there is actually a pitch rise aorund 0:05
The pitch drop is around 0:11

I remember once fooling around with a drum computer that had a steel pans sound and I tuned those manually, because the preset sounds were out of tune.