Community Guidelines: We need your feedback!

Community Guidelines: We need your feedback!

Postby TheAssassin0 » 25 Jun 2020, 04:29

The team behind Blue Nebula figured we need some rules and guidelines to help create a positive atmosphere for everyone. We've been brainstorming for a few weeks and thought about how we imagine the community to be and how we can keep it healthy in the long term.

Of course, it might be annoying to have to follow rules. But we figured it's actually better to have such documents available. Otherwise, moderation is subject to arbitrariness, and you can never know whether what you do is okay or not. Also, such arbitrariness likely creates a gap in between developers, moderators and players, which is exactly we want to avoid. Yes, global moderation is needed, but it should be transparent and self-reflective. We want to clearly outline the difference between recommendations (which we ask you to adhere to), and rules (which the moderators need to enforce), so it's absolutely clear to all sides.

Therefore, today, we ask for your help! Please review our draft, leave your opinion and help define the future of our community. There shall be no dictatorship of any kind from the devs towards the players or vise versa. We encourage every community member to provide constructive feedback. The drafts are available on GitHub. If, for example, there are rules you don't agree with, points which you think need further clarification or other topics you think should be covered, please don't hesitate to reply to this forum thread.

By the way, we plan to do regular reviews to make sure the guidelines develop together with the community. There's no full-featured concept for that yet, though. We'll create another post in the forum about that topic soon.
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Re: Community Guidelines: We need your feedback!

Postby Lyberta » 25 Jun 2020, 09:25

OK, draconian insanity same as RE. I'm out.
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Re: Community Guidelines: We need your feedback!

Postby Julius » 25 Jun 2020, 11:35

Come on :) They are specifically asking for feedback, so at least try to give some constructive critisism about what is "draconian insanity" about it.

Personally I think in game moderation should be left to the server admins to decide, and is hard to enforce anyways.
“Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn’t go away.” - Philip K. Dick
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Re: Community Guidelines: We need your feedback!

Postby freem » 25 Jun 2020, 20:01

Well, as said, it is:

1) a draft, so it needs to be discussed and validated by community
2) not cast in stone (which is why it's in a git repository, actually)

There is already stuff we know we need to add and discuss, for code contributions for example (you know, coding styles), but we felt it would be a good idea to have people commenting on a general purpose draft.
The reason we felt this is exactly, to *not* setting up a dictatorship or something like that.
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Re: Community Guidelines: We need your feedback!

Postby Lyberta » 01 Jul 2020, 16:30

Since the word "master" is now officially offensive (about time btw), the whole concept of master server is all about slavery and taking away people's freedoms. So from now on we can call non-master servers slave servers. Or just put away all pretense and call them N-word servers.

Slavery and racism don't belong in free software. People who write software with support for master servers are to be presumed alt right racists. Black Lives Don't Matter if you touch a master server.


EDIT: OK, my breakdown is over. But the truth that servers (and players) have to obey master server is still there. And the word "master" is still there and it was deemed offensive for very valid reasons.

I would have tolerated Blue Nebula master server and the project as a whole if there would be no global moderation system. Nothing prevents developers running their own official vanilla servers with proper moderation. But having server owners give control to random untrusted people is crossing the line by a mile.
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Re: Community Guidelines: We need your feedback!

Postby freem » 02 Jul 2020, 23:35

Just to be sure, do you know there is an ongoing project to implement multi master?
Which means, a client can register to more than one master, and same for servers?
Our goal is *not* to be the only rulers of the *true* FPS, only to be certain that, when one joins a server, that one can have a clear idea of the local rules, without having a wrong impression. To establish an at least theoretic protection against cheating, and moderator abuses.

Again, this is a _draft_, and we would love the community's input on it, on points that are not acceptable, and why.
Maybe our starting point does not need to be that... hum, strict?
Maybe we can just try and build over time?
We need suggestions, not just "hey, this sucks, I'm over" without decent explanation.

Forgive me if my words are harsh.
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Re: Community Guidelines: We need your feedback!

Postby freem » 03 Jul 2020, 00:06

Well, I could have edited, but it feels a bit like a lie after some time.

I forgot to mention that the most important rules there is... To say that a server applies a different ruleset in the description. So that newcommers can know at which game they'll play, instead of discovering that, for example, the rifle heals instead of damaging.
Of course, there is a ratio of changes indicated in the serverbrowser, but currently, it's useless, it's only about the percentage of variables that are not default, so, for example, if you block some mods or mutators, you will have differences.
Also, I still have to see differences above 1%, and while 1% seems negligible, it's still a lot if you change the good vars.

I, personnally, plan to improve that, too, because I believe some vars should not be in that score, and also I believe that a «modscore» should be built on derivation from origin, too. It's for later, though. Time is sparse.
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Re: Community Guidelines: We need your feedback!

Postby Lyberta » 04 Jul 2020, 02:23

freem {l Wrote}:do you know there is an ongoing project to implement multi master?


Being a slave to several masters is not better than being a slave to one master.

freem {l Wrote}:To establish an at least theoretic protection against cheating, and moderator abuses.


You remind me of George W Bush: "Let's remove tons of freedoms of all people for the sake of mythical 'War on Terror' ".
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Re: Community Guidelines: We need your feedback!

Postby dulsi » 04 Jul 2020, 14:29

Lyberta is fixated on the use of the term master. With the Black Live Matter movement there is some suggestion that we not use master/slave. In this case, it is really an official server list vs third party server list. You could go with something else like registration server or discover server, Lyberta do you have any terminology you would prefer?

If your preference is that there is no official server list, then there is probably nothing that can be done. Providing some server list of friendly servers is something players want to easily get started. Kinda like how joinmastodon.org on lists servers "committed to active moderation against racism, sexism and transphobia." However I doubt they are stopping you from running your own server. You can then invite all the griefers you want.
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Re: Community Guidelines: We need your feedback!

Postby Lyberta » 05 Jul 2020, 01:33

dulsi {l Wrote}:Lyberta is fixated on the use of the term master.


It is much more than that.
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Re: Community Guidelines: We need your feedback!

Postby Matadula » 05 Jul 2020, 15:12

Lyberta {l Wrote}:I would have tolerated Blue Nebula master server and the project as a whole if there would be no global moderation system.


I understand your point, but as someone who has seen real trolling on RE/BN (from insults to sexual harassment of minors) i think global moderation is preferable. Considering that the community is small, we wouldn't have enough people to attend reports and offer proper moderation otherwise.

Still, we could add an option to server owners to opt-out of the auth system. About modified servers, we could sort them out like Xonotic does.
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Re: Community Guidelines: We need your feedback!

Postby Lyberta » Today, 06:07

Matadula {l Wrote}:I understand your point, but as someone who has seen real trolling on RE/BN (from insults to sexual harassment of minors) i think global moderation is preferable.


Again, using nuclear option and making lives of all users worse just because there were a couple of trolls.
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