OpenDungeons TODO

[Danimal]

Its good to hear again of you Skorpio, is this solution also good for the floor tiles?

[Skorpio]

I forgot to mention that neither normal nor spec maps will work with the old material scripts if I remember correctly, so changing them back is not really a good option.

[Danimal]

So, Paul, Bertram, can the models be fixed?

[Bertram]

Hi,

Sorry for the late answer, I was away from internet for a few days.
I still need to make a few own tries and look at all this more carefully before making a relevant answer here, or ask relevant questions.

Stay tuned!

[Bertram]

Hi there,

@Skorpio
Thanks for all the explanations:

Regarding the materials, I changed them all, when oln introduced normal mapping, to this format: [...]
I forgot to mention that neither normal nor spec maps will work with the old material scripts if I remember correctly, so changing them back is not really a good option.

Well, I'm a noob in model handling so sorry in advance for my basic questions, but I'll need to make sure of certain things before moving on with this:
- So Paul said it was mostly due to obsolete Nvidia CG scripts, is that the "old" or the "new" format?
EDIT: Seems the material format is the one of Ogre. If it's true, then the problem wasn't about obsolete Nvidia CG scripts, after all.

- When you say oln introduced normal mapping, you mean that OD does support it (through Ogre for instance, I guess)?

Now for the core of the problem and possible solutions, so far, from what I saw, only models with old declaration seem to work, such as the Dragon, if I got it correctly.
All the other models are white seemingly because of the general.material file imported in the files with the new format.
Note that the general.material file is declared in the "old" format and uses a White.png texture, which is well... white, explaining the color.

Also, from what I understand, there is neither explicit texturing statement nor colormap statement in the file with new format; eg:

{l Code}: {l Select All Code}

import base_material from "general.material"
material Gnome : base_material
{
    set_texture_alias diffuseMap Gnome.png
    set_texture_alias specMap Gnome.png
    //set_texture_alias normalMap Gnome.png
}

Would adding such a statement in the files fix the problem?

Best regards,

[Skorpio]

I can't help much here, because I've no idea what the programmers have done and I don't know enough about OGRE's material system (especially the normal map documentation is not very helpful). OGRE supports normal maps, but I think some special shader programs (or something else?) were needed to make them work.

[Bertram]

Hi Skorpio,

Thanks for answering.

I'll make tries so things are working for the next release.

Yet, there is something I need to ask. Sorry for being direct but: Did you upgrade the materials without knowing whether they were going to work with the engine?
Was this a decision made in the waiting for certain features, for instance?
Please, don't see this as an offending question. But I need to sort out things before moving on. I'm still learning what has been done.

Best regards,

[Skorpio]

I changed all materials because the lighting looked nicer with the new scripts even on the models which had no normal and spec maps, and I also wanted to upgrade or replace the older models sometime (baking normal maps from hi-poly models). In version 0.48 all materials worked correctly.

[Bertram]

Hi Skorpio,

Thanks for the answer! So something broke between Ogre 1.7 and 1.9. Next step, the Ogre forums!

Stay tuned!

[Bertram]

I've opened a topic on the Ogre forums. Feel free to tell me whether I've put something wrong or forgot to tell anything important:
http://www.ogre3d.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=80277

[paul424]

Ohh , I see you have commited some code to development branch , thanks very much , indeed !

[Bertram]

Hi there,

@Skorpio, I'll make tries to still use the material current values but maybe use things that seem to work on 1.9. Maybe the orge forums can help us, too.
I've seen a creature looking like an ogre doesn't move or fight (missing animation). Could you have a look at that?

@Paul, thanks! I've pushed other ones to remove the complexity of the Creature::doTurn() function mostly.
Those have required a lot of testing to make sure everything was still fine.
As a good side-effect, creatures now start at full-health, and the workers are going to dig tiles they can see more reliably now.

Best regards,

[Skorpio]

I've seen a creature looking like an ogre doesn't move or fight (missing animation). Could you have a look at that?

Do you maybe mean the training dummy?

[paul424]

Sorry , to say that , but if you would launch the binary windows version , which Bertram proudly prepared ( also for you ) from time to time you would be less confused when asking questions like this.

[Danimal]

C´mon Paul, he´s kind enought to help after being gone for long; Bertran, you mean the one that looks like being made of gold?(graphic problem, hes made of leather) thats a punching dummy. If its not that one please post a pic, since i havent seen any creture not working like that.

[paul424]

Here;s video of faulty Ogre ( not 3d engine ) ; http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1e1qc7_faultyogre_videogames

[Skorpio]

It seems the animations of the orc don't work. Try out the Orc.mesh and Orc.skeleton in the SVN repository which I've just uploaded.

I've checked out the new version, but it's so bugged that I don't want to keep the program open for more than a minute. I get really nasty lags every turn, the camera can only scroll up-down, left-right and vice versa, yaw, pitch and zoom don't work (the camera moves a bit and then jumps back to the previous position), when I try to exit I sometimes just get a black screen and have to close it with the task manager.

[Bertram]

Hi everyone,

Do you maybe mean the training dummy?

Bertran, you mean the one that looks like being made of gold?(graphic problem, hes made of leather) thats a punching dummy. If its not that one please post a pic, since i havent seen any creture not working like that.

I was indeed not speaking about the training doll.Yep, sorry, I was thinking about uploading a picture but ran out fo time.

It seems the animations of the orc don't work. Try out the Orc.mesh and Orc.skeleton in the SVN repository which I've just uploaded.

Yes, must be that one. I'll try uploading it and make a new binary afterward (but just can't today).
Can you tell me the best way to open a OD mesh and skeleton file? Is that documented somewhere?
(Please teach me your knowledge to me, filthy mortal, O grandmaster of models. ;])

Ah, and also, I guess you've seen certain walls are transparent (seen in gold and dirt walls)? May it be a problems from the models? I can add a picture of that if you want.

I've checked out the new version, but it's so bugged that I don't want to keep the program open for more than a minute. I get really nasty lags every turn, the camera can only scroll up-down, left-right and vice versa, yaw, pitch and zoom don't work (the camera moves a bit and then jumps back to the previous position), when I try to exit I sometimes just get a black screen and have to close it with the task manager.

Yep, all that needs cleaning up. For now, I focused and keep focusing exclusively at making code cleanups to follow the hacking convention and remove some hard bit of useless complexity in it. Believe me, it's some work already. The code doesn't trigger warnings on linux anymore (except one) which already helps seeking new appearing ones while cleaning.
And I do think all that is needed in the first place before fixing other things.

As for the crash at app exit, I do think it's been there since a long time since I've seen it documented somewhere, years ago. IMHO, it might comes from either resources mismanagement, or debug code triggering useless early exits. I'm working toward not making the game exit for no proper reason and log it instead, but I do think it's an issue that can only be looked at step by step.

Zoom is working, using the mouse wheel (I made sure of that). If another key should trigger the same behaviour, tell me as I could fix it rather easily.
The tilting is working but is way too sensible and can be triggered when dragging LMB and when on the left or right part of the screen (which is not a relevant way to control that if you ask me, btw.).

I'd really like to restore the camera move keys into the following working state (any help welcome on that):
wsdq: Strafe (working)
a e : rotate camera left or right.
page up/page down: tilt up or down. (working through mouse dragging and LMB pressed, I'd move that to the keys use only)
zoom: mouse wheel (working)

What do you guys think about it?
Personally, I'd use keys only for less often needed moves as they usually accidentally get in the way while playing otherwise.

Ah, also, I don't know about you but I'd like to get a clear consensus about that:
I'd like to remove the camera strafing behaviour when reaching the edge of the window. Why? Because the strafe keys are here for that, and it gets in the way often when searching a wall, a creature, and or scrolling the objective window. To me, it's not very usable in the end.

Best regards,

[paul424]

USE IRC dudes,
How do I display game statistics , now?
Especially the FPS ?
Any idea how we could have shoutbox, the forum admins doesn't give a damn about it ....

[Skorpio]

Can you tell me the best way to open a OD mesh and skeleton file? Is that documented somewhere?

Those are just the exported OGRE formats, I don't work with them directly. If you want to change something you have to use the source .blend file of the model and then export it again.

Zoom is working, using the mouse wheel (I made sure of that).

Mouse wheel doesn't work for me either.

Ah, and also, I guess you've seen certain walls are transparent (seen in gold and dirt walls)? May it be a problems from the models? I can add a picture of that if you want.

You mean the gaps between some walls? It seems the tile set isn't used correctly, but I'm not sure if we should fix that or rather work on a new, simpler tile set.

[Bertram]

Those are just the exported OGRE formats, I don't work with them directly. If you want to change something you have to use the source .blend file of the model and then export it again.

Ok, I'll have to get used to that, I guess. How did you fix the orc animation, btw. I tested and it's working.

Mouse wheel doesn't work for me either.

Weird, works just fine here. you can move higher/lower very easily (in game mode - I just fixed the editor mode about that now but it's not pushed yet).

You mean the gaps between some walls? It seems the tile set isn't used correctly, but I'm not sure if we should fix that or rather work on a new, simpler tile set.

I'm all for for simpler things and simplifications in general. Can you do something about this?

How do I display game statistics , now?
Especially the FPS ?

Err. Well, I asked you before even pushing this change. Anyway, the "debug info" (Please note that it is anything but game statistics in a player point of view) can be toggled with F11 in game mode now. I'll fix the editor mode about that asap.

USE IRC dudes,

Sorry, but I just don't have time for that, atm.

Best regards,

[Skorpio]

How did you fix the orc animation, btw. I tested and it's working.

I actually fixed that a long time ago, but obviously forgot to update the file in the repo. Something went wrong with the export of the animations if I remember correctly.

I'm all for for simpler things and simplifications in general. Can you do something about this?

I've suggested a different tile set system already, but the idea needs to be worked out and tested first.
viewtopic.php?f=38&t=3913 I think this solution is closer to the original Dungeon Keeper games.

[Bertram]

Ok. Yet, according to the link given, it seems you had trouble while making the mk3. Can we help you in any way about this or do you just need time?

Best regards,

[Danimal]

May i propose the floor tiles to be fixed before anything else? the game looks rigth now like a botomless pit of darkness as the imps expand your land

[Bertram]

HI,

May i propose the floor tiles to be fixed before anything else? the game looks rigth now like a botomless pit of darkness as the imps expand your land

Indeed, actually, it's some kind of dark green texture applied on top of the normal tile.
Atm, I don't know what is the desired effect or even where it is coded exactly.
Maybe Paul has got an idea?

For the good news, I managed to locally kill a big bunch of duplicated or dead code, and successfully move the map loading out of the rendering management.
For a noob like me, it sounds like a victory.

I'll be focusing on the camera movement and on saving maps for now.

Stay tuned.