Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Skorpio » 19 Dec 2012, 13:40

There's another Dungeon Keeper clone project and the dev uses some of our media. He even implemented the new tile set. :) I forgot to ask how he called his project, but invited him to join us. However, he writes in Java not C++.
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Julius » 19 Dec 2012, 15:50

Hmm looks not too bad... but I wonder since he seemed to be aware of OD from the start, what exactly his reasons for not joining are. But well, if he is committed and opens up his code, that could be an alternative instead of trying to revive OD.
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Flipflop » 20 Dec 2012, 11:27

Hey guys,

its me from this Project:
Skorpio wrote:There's another Dungeon Keeper clone project and the dev uses some of our media. He even implemented the new tile set. :) I forgot to ask how he called his project, but invited him to join us. However, he writes in Java not C++.


I dont have a Name for it yet. Maybe DungeonAgent or AgentKeeper.

Why Agent? It is implemented with the KI of BDI-Agents. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belief%E2% ... ware_model
I made this Work for the University of Hamburg for their Jadex Open-Source BDI-Agent Framework. http://www.activecomponents.org/bin/view/About/Features I also implemented the 3d Support for this Framework. Thats why i can´t just join OD. And the fact that i have no idea about C++ :)

My Project has the goal to show what is possible with Agent-Orientated Programming in a interesting way for the Students (We all love games...). And it will be Open Source too of course. I am using the Open Source 3d-Java Jmonkey Engine 3.0 for Rendering http://jmonkeyengine.org/.

>our Project inspired me alot, thats for sure. Thats why i want to try to share ideas and solutions. For this moment my solution of how i implemented Skorpios FANTASTIC Tilesets would be a good start. Where should it be? Code area or "Models & Graphics"?

- Flipflop
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby oln » 20 Dec 2012, 12:19

I agree with julius, if he shouild decide to keep working on this and opens the code, then that could be a way to continue the project. Since no one seems to be working the current code anyhow, I don't see a problem with "discarding" it.

As for implementing the tilesets in the old code, it's not the case that we (or atleast I) don't know how to do it. It's not really very complicated. It's simply the fact that I haven't really been able to work on the project since spring 2011, and no one else has tried to work on that part since.
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby charlie » 20 Dec 2012, 13:43

FYI, Flipfop's post got approved after oln posted (hence in effect oln posted before it).
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Julius » 20 Dec 2012, 16:04

@flipflip, that sounds interesting, jmonkey is a good choice too. You are working on it as a researcher/PhD? If so, what is your expected timeframe for continued professional "support" to this particular game?
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Flipflop » 20 Dec 2012, 16:11

Hello Julius,

i am working on it as an Master Informatic Student as an Science Assistence. The main plattform is supported by two Dr.(finished PHDs). and two PHDs. I am resposible for the 3d Enviroment Support.
I also wrote my Bachelor Thesis about the 3d Support I implemented for that Framework. I work here at least for an other Year, but I also spend LOTS OF freetime on the Project.
So one Year Professional "support" ist guaranteed.

After that it depends on what I find for a Work when my Master is finished. I also think about to write my thesis about it and the Dr. here want me to continue here as PHD, but i am not sure yet.... :)
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Julius » 20 Dec 2012, 16:23

Ahh ok... well that sounds like the 1 year deadline rule for FOSS games just as explained by Bart in the latest FreeGamer blog post ;) So make sure you got a playable prototype by then :p

Btw, any plans to deviate from the std. DungeonKeeper concept to make it more interesting than a pure clone? I assume the special AI (KI in German) isn't going to make such a big difference on game-play from a non programmers perspective?
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Flipflop » 20 Dec 2012, 16:34

Of course, we have lots of Ideas! We dont want to "just clone it". Its also not allowed from the copyright perspective or? But first we want to make it playable enough to try out all our Ideas.

Special AI...you mean because we are using BDI-Agents? There are indeed very powerfull and efficient. We also have simpler MicroAgents for simple Behavior. Like the Chickens in the Hatchery.
Its also really easy for Programmer (if you understand the basic concepts) to develop complicated AI in this kind of system.
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Skorpio » 20 Dec 2012, 16:43

Flipflop wrote:Of course, we have lots of Ideas! We dont want to "just clone it". Its also not allowed from the copyright perspective or?

I think it's allowed to clone game mechanics, but not the art.
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Flipflop » 08 Jan 2013, 10:28

We decided to publish the code from our Project as Open Source. Besides that we will make a "standalone" Version that came along with the application.xml file. That is the place where is saved which object is distplayed how. There all you artist can just bind different objects and use it as an "playground". Or people can download it to just play with the newest developement status.

The source and the standalone version will be published as nightly builds. We want to achieve that as fast as possible. I think end of this month is quite realistic.
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby oln » 08 Jan 2013, 19:04

Sounds great! Looking forward to it.
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby paul424 » 08 Jan 2013, 21:22

I just cannot belive my eyes how does that forum turns from orginal project's forum to chearleading external project's team ... which is somehow better cause their are ... just doing they work and implementing what they have planned before .... <sight>
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby charlie » 09 Jan 2013, 01:33

paul424 wrote:I just cannot belive my eyes how does that forum turns from orginal project's forum to chearleading external project's team ... which is somehow better cause their are ... just doing they work and implementing what they have planned before .... <sight>

Nobody is stopping you Paul. Heed your own advise/observation? Crack on and do something! ;)
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Flipflop » 09 Jan 2013, 17:38

Hey, I dont want to create any trouble. Just want to share with you people. I came to this board/project because of Skorpios Tilesets on OpenGameart. Thought is a good idea to offer some help (Tilesets implementation) because Skorpio asked me to do so.
Then more and more people asking for playable version and/or the code which I will happly share. Like you are sharing your assets and code too. I am also totally open to new ideas/input from this community. But I dont want to steal skill or time from this Open Dungeons Project.
So maybe some people want to work with me on my Project in future together....that would be nice of course, but i think Open Dungeons will only benefit from that...or? And I never asked or begged for help or something like that. Just want to share my work and ideas with you people. If someone would like to help with ideas, assets, concetps or whatever he or she is very welcome but I dont want to be something like an counterpart, really. I totally respect this fantastic Project you have here.
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby charlie » 09 Jan 2013, 20:36

You're not causing trouble, Paul is.
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby paul424 » 09 Jan 2013, 21:06

I just wanted to express my ironic - pesymistic mood yesterday. Peace .
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby oln » 09 Jan 2013, 22:08

Stop the hatin' guys.

No one is causing trouble. I think some of the old-timers are just happy that something is happening. (Also, paul424 has been coding a bit recently, there are some commits, though I haven't tested it.)

I think the best course of action would be to work together with flipflop, as his project is kind of guaranteed to being worked on anyway. I think it's the more safe option. I think it's better to avoid fragmentation. Especially if we have the opportunity to suggest ideas and influence it. I can't do much work myself right now, though I do have a fair bit of experience with Java if I should be able to work again at some point in the distant future. (I know svenskmand knows java as well, though I haven't seen him around for ages, don't know about paul424.)

Of course, everyone is free to do as they wish, I'm not going to shut down the repositories, and it's open so people can fork if they want to.
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby charlie » 09 Jan 2013, 23:57

I'm not sure OD needs to abandon its codebase oln; that's premature. It's good to see a DK-like project making rapid progress, and part of the reason FlipFlop posted here was a constructive hint at how to implement Skorpio's tileset - which the OD devs can copy rather than have to work out themselves.
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Flipflop » 24 Jan 2013, 15:15

Just a small Update to show I am still alive and "active" :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8W77cB_mMiI

I know the GUI is not pretty at all yet...but okay, its a beginning. The Overwiew Map ist also not finished. Will create an more "abstract" Szene only for the Map. And some Viewport-Functionality like in DK2. I like my Blue-Selector-Tool. ah...and If you look closely you can see the active cursor-selected Object in the top-right corner. Btw. in the End you can see a small Bug, the last dirt-tile is destroyed with delay. ^^
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Danimal » 24 Jan 2013, 16:40

Its looking pretty nice, once you give a claiming animation to Imps and update the claiming sound it will look even better. I see you also added the creature types to the gui; only bad thing, the wall textures are still the same than the ground and the digging sound, sounds like its made in a big empty space with no ground (or like a terrain landslide) making it shorter might help perhaps. Anyways, those are just trivial things rigth now, development is more important. Good work there.

Once i have ready the doors and traps models i would be happy to see them here, my "adventurer" model as well.
viewtopic.php?f=38&t=2903&start=75#p38082
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Julius » 24 Jan 2013, 18:02

Yeah, I agree, the ground textures on the walls don't look good. I know you saif you don't really like the castle like 2nd tile set of Skorpio, but as a secondary reinforcement of the walls to make them more resilient to break-in it would probably look nice.
For normal walls a more mine like texture with wooden stalks, or a gabion like wire mesh would be probably nice.
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Julius » 24 Jan 2013, 18:19

Oh and I made a collection of nice GUI graphics:
http://opengameart.org/content/nice-gui-elements
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Flipflop » 24 Jan 2013, 18:29

Julius wrote:Yeah, I agree, the ground textures on the walls don't look good. I know you saif you don't really like the castle like 2nd tile set of Skorpio, but as a secondary reinforcement of the walls to make them more resilient to break-in it would probably look nice.
For normal walls a more mine like texture with wooden stalks, or a gabion like wire mesh would be probably nice.

yeah, i am already working on a new Solution. But my Blender skills are far from experienced....still fighting with the UV maps. ^^


Julius wrote:Oh and I made a collection of nice GUI graphics:
http://opengameart.org/content/nice-gui-elements


hehe, really nice. Thanks. I found alot there too, as you can see the thee Buttons are already from OpenGameArt. You might notice that I am more a coder than an good artist. Not in Gui, not in 3d. Even my renders for the Monster Overview look a bit ugly.. :) Just quick n dirty to show some aspects as fast as possible.

Yeah, the Digging sound, should fix it someday. So many things to do(!). Gui (Design & Layout), Ai, Graphics, Sounds, Gameprocesses, User Input, Gameplay, Balancing, Eco Systems, Code cleanup etc. Always dont know where to start.

- Philip
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Re: Another Dungeon Keeper Project

Postby Skorpio » 25 Jan 2013, 14:32

The new video looks great. Of course the lighting and claimed walls need to be improved, but the game already creates a nice DK-feeling. BTW I think the walls could be a bit higher, maybe I should try to rescale them.
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